List Mgmt. 2020 Trade Thread - Part III

[CursingFijian]

Even with the addition of Crouch, I still think we are the best fit for Treloar. Do the Doggies really need him?

I think Treloar only gets to us if he takes a BIG haircut. Like shave the top and sides and keep a little bit at the back, with the option to grow that into a full blown mullet after Hannerbery falls off the list.

But seriously, Crouch and Hanners will have hamstring issues next year. Treloar will too you would think.

The risk is we end up paying an almighty amount of money for just one of them to be on the park at any point in time.

Collingwoods money issues flabbergast me. It’s almost like there is a culture of selfishness, a take care of me first and best of luck to you attitude towards money.

We aren’t hearing about other perennial top 4 clubs needing to push any of their elite players out the door. Think West Coast. Think Geelong. Both of which consistently bring in players who WANT TO BE AT THEIR CLUB. The insinuation being that they are prepared to play for a little less.

I think St Kilda has done A LOT right. Build a cutting edge facility, create an elite training environment, play an attractive winning style, reconnect with our heartland, and underpin that all with wholesome, caring, family values.

And now players WANT to be at Moorabbin.

Let’s not undo all of that by biting off more than we can chew salary cap wise. Especially in these weird and challenging times. We just can’t say with certainty we categorically know how the AFL moves forward from here. I think a little prudence now might mean we can set ourselves up for continued drafting and trading success no matter what the future holds.

We have done extremely well to this point. A Ryder replacement. A Carlisle replacement. Get Hanners and Crouch to max health. Continue to recruit good kids. Hold on to our core. That should be the focus from here.

 

[Joffaboy]

That would be pretty sweet little payback for dodoro getting the hawks involved with carlisle years ago.

Ameet was crafty enough to get sydney involved meaning we walked away with carlisle and a ripper deal still, despite hawthorns interest making us cough up a bit more than we were going to.

Jake got nervous about potentially ending up in the PSD because the trade was going down the wire near deadline- and sounds like he very nearly switched his nomination to the hawks just to avoid the uncertainty.

Perhaps Jye is equally happy to forego a bit of coin and switch his nomination to us if we can provide him certainty that a trade can be done way before deadline?

Especially now that he knows that the bombers are neck deep into dunkley- all of a sudden our crouch trade isn't a huge differentiator.

Lets get Caldwell in, then get treloar and tell Caldwell, we are developing you at Sandy for the next to years.

 

[L_W_P]

Would treloar take a pay cut?

Nup, but if we back end into the last 3 years (dangerous I know) then Pies can pay him 300k for next year and we settle everything with Savage, Dunstan, Roberton, Geary, Webster, Hanners etc coming off the list over the next 12-24 months.

Other option would be to add on a 6th year for an additional 5 bucks and we pay him 750 a year over 6 vs 900 a year over 5.

Risky given he has had soft tissue injuries but if it gets him in while we are gearing up for an assault on the top 4 and winning a flag then yeah, ****ing go for it.

The offset to all this is how much room it leaves us to sign up King, Gresh, Steele etc in 3-4 years time...

 

[LiterallyNobody]

Lets get Caldwell in, then get treloar and tell Caldwell, we are developing you at Sandy for the next to years.

OMG you're pure evil..... I love it!!!!

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I think Treloar only gets to us if he takes a BIG haircut. Like shave the top and sides and keep a little bit at the back, with the option to grow that into a full blown mullet after Hannerbery falls off the list.

But seriously, Crouch and Hanners will have hamstring issues next year. Treloar will too you would think.

The risk is we end up paying an almighty amount of money for just one of them to be on the park at any point in time.

Collingwoods money issues flabbergast me. It’s almost like there is a culture of selfishness, a take care of me first and best of luck to you attitude towards money.

We aren’t hearing about other perennial top 4 clubs needing to push any of their elite players out the door. Think West Coast. Think Geelong. Both of which consistently bring in players who WANT TO BE AT THEIR CLUB. The insinuation being that they are prepared to play for a little less.

I think St Kilda has done A LOT right. Build a cutting edge facility, create an elite training environment, play an attractive winning style, reconnect with our heartland, and underpin that all with wholesome, caring, family values.

Let’s not undo all of that by biting off more than we can chew salary cap wise. Especially in these weird and challenging times. We just can’t say with certainty we categorically know how the AFL moves forward from here. I think a little prudence now might mean we can set ourselves up for continued drafting and trading success no matter what the future holds.

We have done extremely well to this point. A Ryder replacement. A Carlisle replacement. Get Hanners and Crouch to max health. Continue to recruit good kids. Hold on to our core. That should be the focus from here.

To me , they've done what they have to each year, to sign up their stars, to get new players in....shuffle the money into the future, so its ok NOW.
Suddenly the future has caught up with them and ...oh shit.

Someone told me a lot of the clubs offering big deals are assuming that the salary cap will continue to go up. So a year like 2020 puts a serious dent in their plans.

 

[_Maximus_12]

Can we trade Brendan Goddard for Radio Silence on Trade Radio?
Have listened for a total of 10 minutes this year and he is a boring sod

 

[SaintJunior]

Didn’t Goddard’ mum cuddle him as a baby or something.

Have never heard anyway crave the need to feel loved more than him, quite sad.

Chose to explore free agency as was his right the club rightly or wrongly were happy for him to walk.

He thought he should be the next captain, he demonstrates in his time at Essendon that he was not a great leader.

Carries on about his service, at the end of the day he was remunerated and remunerated well for his service.

Gave his all as a player and that was fantastic but he needs to grow up and realise that Pelchen was a custodian of the club an employee but he iis not the club. Find it funny that he does not seem to harbour any angst or anger to Essendon who got him in and were clearly not honest about the goings on there.

Seriously between him Julian De Stoop it should be named Essendon Fan boy radio not trade radio.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Didn’t Goddard’ mum cuddle him as a baby or something.

Have never heard anyway crave the need to feel loved more than him, quite sad.

Chose to explore free agency as was his right the club rightly or wrongly were happy for him to walk.

He thought he should be the next captain, he demonstrates in his time at Essendon that he was not a great leader.

Carries on about his service, at the end of the day he was remunerated and remunerated well for his service.

Gave his all as a player and that was fantastic but he needs to grow up and realise that Pelchen was a custodian of the club an employee but he iis not the club. Find it funny that he does not seem to harbour any angst or anger to Essendon who got him in and were clearly not honest about the goings on there.

Seriously between him Julian De Stoop it should be named Essendon Fan boy radio not trade radio.

When Riewoldt got his big pay day, Goddard was supposed to be next on the list. His big pay day never came.

 

[Veer Right]

Interesting listening to Goddard talk about leaving St Kilda. Makes it pretty clear it was Pelchen that basically forced him out.

Seriously how much of a disaster was Pelchen.

Thank god we have a competent off field team now. Looking like another A grade trade period coming up.

I remember the consensus at the time was that Goddard wanted 650k, we didn't want to pay him that and so he walked to Essendon. Barely any St Kilda people were that phased either at the turn of events yet still sad at the loss.

 

[Strahany]

When Riewoldt got his big pay day, Goddard was supposed to be next on the list. His big pay day never came.

Brendon was one of my favourites during his time at the Saints but, if we’re speaking truthfully, he only had 2 years as an absolute top flight player, and a 1-2 on the precipice of being elite. Other than that, he started off really slowly and was just solid-good before his ascension.

Riewoldt dominated the opposition for the better part of a decade and changed the model for a KPF. There’s really no comparison.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

I remember the consensus at the time was that Goddard wanted 650k, we didn't want to pay him that and so he walked to Essendon. Barely any St Kilda people were that phased either at the turn of events yet still sad at the loss.

They couldn't .
They were still paying players who had retired.

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Brendon was one of my favourites during his time at the Saints but, if we’re speaking truthfully, he only had 2 years as an absolute top flight player, and a 1-2 on the precipice of being elite. Other than that, he started off really slowly and was just solid-good before his ascension.

Riewoldt dominated the opposition for the better part of a decade and changed the model for a KPF. There’s really no comparison.

Players drafted early tend to feel "entitled " if they are half good.
I liked Goddard, but i never felt that he was as important to the club as Fisher, Dempster, Schneider, Milne, DalSanto, or even Montagna.

 

[Tommy Wigs]

Didn’t Goddard’ mum cuddle him as a baby or something.

Have never heard anyway crave the need to feel loved more than him, quite sad.

Chose to explore free agency as was his right the club rightly or wrongly were happy for him to walk.

He thought he should be the next captain, he demonstrates in his time at Essendon that he was not a great leader.

Carries on about his service, at the end of the day he was remunerated and remunerated well for his service.

Gave his all as a player and that was fantastic but he needs to grow up and realise that Pelchen was a custodian of the club an employee but he iis not the club. Find it funny that he does not seem to harbour any angst or anger to Essendon who got him in and were clearly not honest about the goings on there.

Seriously between him Julian De Stoop it should be named Essendon Fan boy radio not trade radio.

Yep, I lasted about two minutes

 

[Veer Right]

They couldn't .
They were still paying players who had retired.

I find that hard to believe.

 

[FootyMaster11]

This is just my thinking, but if we could get Collingwood to agree on a price they would pay (lets say 150-200k per year over a few years) and Treloar wanted to come to us, then we could get it done.

For example, Ross would be on around 550-600k. If we brought in Treloar, we then have no need for Ross, as even though he was good in a few games last year he becomes the 4th or 5th best mid (Steele, Treloar, Crouch, Jones) and was primarily used to tag remember.

Effectively we are paying 100-150k more to have Treloar to play for us than Ross, it may not be popular, but if we wanted to get it done, that is one way.

 

[busso_mick]

I think Treloar only gets to us if he takes a BIG haircut. Like shave the top and sides and keep a little bit at the back, with the option to grow that into a full blown mullet after Hannerbery falls off the list.

But seriously, Crouch and Hanners will have hamstring issues next year. Treloar will too you would think.

The risk is we end up paying an almighty amount of money for just one of them to be on the park at any point in time.

Collingwoods money issues flabbergast me. It’s almost like there is a culture of selfishness, a take care of me first and best of luck to you attitude towards money.

We aren’t hearing about other perennial top 4 clubs needing to push any of their elite players out the door. Think West Coast. Think Geelong. Both of which consistently bring in players who WANT TO BE AT THEIR CLUB. The insinuation being that they are prepared to play for a little less.

I think St Kilda has done A LOT right. Build a cutting edge facility, create an elite training environment, play an attractive winning style, reconnect with our heartland, and underpin that all with wholesome, caring, family values.

Let’s not undo all of that by biting off more than we can chew salary cap wise. Especially in these weird and challenging times. We just can’t say with certainty we categorically know how the AFL moves forward from here. I think a little prudence now might mean we can set ourselves up for continued drafting and trading success no matter what the future holds.

We have done extremely well to this point. A Ryder replacement. A Carlisle replacement. Get Hanners and Crouch to max health. Continue to recruit good kids. Hold on to our core. That should be the focus from here.

I love your work CF, that is a great post.

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

When Riewoldt got his big pay day, Goddard was supposed to be next on the list. His big pay day never came.

His big pay day came from Essendope.

BJ can spare me the crocodile tears, he had checked out from StK mid year. Some of his efforts in the back half of the season were embarrassing... I clearly remember thinking that he was gone. Then he goes on the Footy Show with a letter from a kid with 50c taped on it, pleading with him not to leave... obviously trying to push the club into giving him want he wanted.

Was given STKFC life membership and has done nothing but bag the club ever since.

And he still doesn't know which King brother we have!

 

[Yawkey way]

Disaster is a bit over the top isn't it?

Not really, it means nothing to give a future second and swap firsts especially if we’re essentially done right?.

Personally I‘d see a future second as overs but clearly I’m in the minority on Higgins value. I really didn’t see another small forward who lacks leg speed and according to ghost can’t follow a game plan as a priority.

I’m definitely looking for picks, we have a first then it’s fourth rounders. You just nether know who’ll still be on the board, with our hand and no future second we’re really screwed and just observers.

Picks matter and not having any or the flexibility to move up to grab a player is potentially disastrous Imo.

 

[Armoooo]

lmao is that true? What was his user name? That's ******* insane if it is.

I'm sorry, I can't remember the user, but they were known to be an ITK at the time.

Based on the things that they posted ahead of any news source, they clearly had some sort of inside knowledge. Every post about RL was hypercritical.

The big smoking gun came from the email used to register (somebody would have needed to sign up with a telco under his name) for the site, the join date, the date he stopped posting and the locations of the IP posted from. I had admin rights at the time so very few people would have been able to look at this evidence.

Part of me thought about leaking the story to the papers at the time, but I thought it would just make the club look like a shambles haha. I literally sat on it for about 5 years. The only reason why I ever brought it up again was because the same thing happened with the Philadelphia 76ers GM being caught doing the same thing on Twitter a couple of years ago.

Makes you think who else you could have bickered with on here over the years haha.

 

[Ducky Tie]

I'm not a Goddard basher and Pelchen was clearly a stain.

I did find it funny though to hear Goddard say he picked Essendon because he wanted success, despite other clubs offering more money, when Essendon had come 11th the previous year.

 

[Veer Right]

Not really, it means nothing to give a future second and swap firsts especially if we’re essentially done right?.

Personally I‘d see a future second as overs but clearly I’m in the minority on Higgins value. I really didn’t see another small forward who lacks leg speed and according to ghost can’t follow a game plan as a priority.

I’m definitely looking for picks, we have a first then it’s fourth rounders. You just nether know who’ll still be on the board, with our hand and no future second we’re really screwed and just observers.

Picks matter and not having any or the flexibility to move up to grab a player is potentially disastrous Imo.

How many times can you say the same thing over and over and over, just rephrasing it. I think we get it!

 

[kernelT]

This is just my thinking, but if we could get Collingwood to agree on a price they would pay (lets say 150-200k per year over a few years) and Treloar wanted to come to us, then we could get it done.

For example, Ross would be on around 550-600k. If we brought in Treloar, we then have no need for Ross, as even though he was good in a few games last year he becomes the 4th or 5th best mid (Steele, Treloar, Crouch, Jones) and was primarily used to tag remember.

Effectively we are paying 100-150k more to have Treloar to play for us than Ross, it may not be popular, but if we wanted to get it done, that is one way.

It's a good point… Even if we had to juggle next years cap, we have a lot of coin coming up out of contract in the next couple of years.

2021
Ross, Roberton, Dunstan, Kent, Geary (2mil ?)

2022
Hannebery, DMac, Webster (1.2- 1.5 mil ?)

Not many of those will get recontracted so we should have plenty of space to play with.

Ross the only player regularly playing, with Geary winding up.

 

[Max the great]

So Stephenson has met with north and appears avaliable.

I must be missing something, he’s a serious talent and at 188cm with serious speed would be a great get from what was a great draft.

No way can we fit his electricity bill into our cap

 

[Winmar2Lockett]

Not really, it means nothing to give a future second and swap firsts especially if we’re essentially done right?.

Personally I‘d see a future second as overs but clearly I’m in the minority on Higgins value. I really didn’t see another small forward who lacks leg speed and according to ghost can’t follow a game plan as a priority.

I’m definitely looking for picks, we have a first then it’s fourth rounders. You just nether know who’ll still be on the board, with our hand and no future second we’re really screwed and just observers.

Picks matter and not having any or the flexibility to move up to grab a player is potentially disastrous Imo.

A disaster isn't paying a little over for a trade IMO.

There's no difference in risk between using a pick for Higgins or keeping that pick so it can be used to take a kid who may not work out. Either way it's not a disaster.

For all the whining about some of the trading stuff ups that we've had (Freeman, etc) none have really hurt us other than the McCartin/Petracca one. You can even make an argument that not taking Petracca has given us more pain but also gave us access to Winx... and I can't think of many StK supporters who would rather have CP than the King.

What is really hurting us now is signing players that are now purely depth to deals that make them very hard to trade to get some of those handy picks in.

 

[ScrappyDo]

I've flip flopped a bit on Treloar over the last couple of weeks, but now that we acquired Crouch and Higgo I've solidified on a hard no.

Over the journey AT has:
.Shifted from GWS because he wanted to play for a "big club" (or big wage perhaps) while others stuck phat
.Is now on the outs at the Filth after his first injury effected year
.Has the most appalling dog of a contract for a club to own
.His Mrs, after playing with the Filth's netball team, couldn't get her spot back and took a gig in Brizzy (seems odd) for which AT allegedly wants weekly time off for family visits
.Took to social media to air his issues, despite having a contract worth circa 4.5M

Now I've panned the Filth for their side of it because their SC management is so bad, and it's the Filth so you stick the boots in when you can.
But as they say "where there's smoke there's fire", and there were 43 other happy campers on the Filthy list this year.

There's more to this than just a s**tty contract.


For us to acquire Adam, we wanna be aware that we'er taking someone who was essentially pushed out of his club whilst they're in a premiership window, and they had gone to great expense to get and keep him on their list to date.
They didn't go hard at offloading 2 medium contracts like Philips and (insert player) so they could keep Adam in the squad for a Premiership.

His contract, even if subsidized by the Filth will run until he's 33.

Being 28 at the start of next season, with indeterminate durability from this point, some known depression and anxiety, with his wife and child interstate and everything written above, I can't see how we could possibly take him on.

I understand people think it will put us in premiership contention, but realistically it will take another year or two for the team to gel and King to to hit his straps, by which time AT will be 30.

I'd much rather in the next 2 years:
.have our FRDP
.put games into Bytel, Byrnes and the FRDPs
.have SC space
.not take on dangerous contracts

Gag's made comment that we are gonna stick to our plan. I'm very glad for that in this case.

Stay the course Saints fans, it's all about Bing in 2022. Till then we keep building, no shortcuts..