List Mgmt. 2021 Draft and Trade Hypotheticals

[Ticky009]

Hi everyone, for those interested some great links plus the Big Footy Draft, Trade & Free Agency twitter as per below:

 

[Dubai Quacker]

Big fan of all three and look forward to watching then play the next 200 games for the Swans..
Mills is a very good player, but without looking I imagine theres a few mids of similar age/experince including 3 x bombers.. Merret, McGrath, Parish who have better numbers. How many 'All Australians' will Mills get?
Same can be said about Rowbum and Warner.
You rate those three, Punts rates Warner and JMac, I rate Stephens and Campbell as our best chance of All Australians (thats not to say Mills, Rowbum, Warner, JMac, Florent won't become AA).
Reckon Stephens has the ability to get 30+ and use the ball well. He's very quick and has very good endurance. Hes just undersized at the moment.
Campbell just has fantastic speed and skills!

Post Parker, JPK, Hewett,, I reckon the midfield group is lacking a clean, strong, powerful, 30+ possession winning clearance king. ie. an Elite Inside Mid
If (a big If) Hewett and Parker aren't Swans next year, then Mills will need help. Both Green and Hopper could offer that help.

Not saying we should or shouldn't.. truth is Ive no idea of what the Swans are thinking or what position they're in with the salary cap, or how gettable certain players are. Any midfield changes needs to be put in context with the needs of the back 6, the needs of a Ruck and the needs of a tall forward to replace Buddy and Reid.
Watching the next couple of trade periods with interest.

Couldn’t agree more.

Campbell and Stephens are our two developing players with the highest ceilings.

Stephens is exactly where Parish was at the same stage - fringe selection, 20 odd possession player, high endurance but very light framed. He’s going to be very, very good in a few years. And other clubs know it.

 

[caesar88]

Big fan of all three and look forward to watching then play the next 200 games for the Swans..
Mills is a very good player, but without looking I imagine theres a few mids of similar age/experince including 3 x bombers.. Merret, McGrath, Parish who have better numbers. How many 'All Australians' will Mills get?
Same can be said about Rowbum and Warner.
You rate those three, Punts rates Warner and JMac, I rate Stephens and Campbell as our best chance of All Australians (thats not to say Mills, Rowbum, Warner, JMac, Florent won't become AA).
Reckon Stephens has the ability to get 30+ and use the ball well. He's very quick and has very good endurance. Hes just undersized at the moment.
Campbell just has fantastic speed and skills!

Post Parker, JPK, Hewett,, I reckon the midfield group is lacking a clean, strong, powerful, 30+ possession winning clearance king. ie. an Elite Inside Mid
If (a big If) Hewett and Parker aren't Swans next year, then Mills will need help. Both Green and Hopper could offer that help.

Not saying we should or shouldn't.. truth is Ive no idea of what the Swans are thinking or what position they're in with the salary cap, or how gettable certain players are. Any midfield changes needs to be put in context with the needs of the back 6, the needs of a Ruck and the needs of a tall forward to replace Buddy and Reid.
Watching the next couple of trade periods with interest.

Fair enough.

I didn't include Stephens and Campbell as they simply haven't been played as mids yet so I can't really rate them the same way as I rate the three I mentioned, who we've actually seen play and perform in that role.

I don't see any reason one (or all) of the three I mentioned can't be that elite mid, clearance beast, All Australian etc that you're looking for.

Mills' first year as a midfielder and he's exceeded expectations. Had some performances where he has been dominant. Balances out his quieter ones and I think he will be elite. I also had no idea he'd be such a good kick inside 50 as I always thought his disposal out of the back half was a little shaky.

Rowbottom going into this year was our young exciting mid for the future. 10 minutes into his season he hyperextends his knee and hasn't looked the same since. Certainly don't think that should change his narrative, he's proven his talent as a mid. Was averaging over 7 clearances a game as a teenager in his best patch of games last year where he was also our 2nd mid. He's the most raw of the lot and I think he's gonna be sensational when his body catches up to where it needs to be.

Warner reminds me of Zak Jones, but with more aptitude for the ball than the man. I also think he'll fair better than Jones, who tried to play the "take the game on" role in a team that wasn't really ready for that. Going into this season I was vocal about my concerns for our future midfield stocks (hence I wanted is to draft Will Phillips) but Mills' addition this year and the surprising breakthrough of Warner has me confident that these three can be a pretty damaging inside trio.

(I would also obviously add Hewett, but you and I have disagreed on him before so I'll save that subject for another day )

 

[Punts]

Stephens isn’t even killing the 2s

Wasted pick

 

[Tedeski]

Stephens isn’t even killing the 2s

Wasted pick

We've butchered the kid!

 

[dosser]

Still not giving up on Fyfe.

 

[swansfan51]

Stephens is exactly where Parish was at the same stage - fringe selection, 20 odd possession player, high endurance but very light framed. He’s going to be very, very good in a few years. And other clubs know it.

1) When was Parish a fringe selection? He played 20 games in each of his first 2 seasons. Stephens played 8, and 4 (so far).

2) When was Stephens a 20 odd possession player? Parish was, sure. He was averaging that consistently in his first 2 seasons, Stephens is averaging 11.5

I'm not shit-canning Stephens, but the facts don't match this narrative.

 

[wildboots43]

Tom Green are all out of contract at GWS

Not correct has extended until 2023

 

[Kapers]

Still not giving up on Fyfe.

This year will be the massive Fyfe, Cripps, Martin pull.

 

[Dubai Quacker]

1) When was Parish a fringe selection? He played 20 games in each of his first 2 seasons. Stephens played 8, and 4 (so far).

2) When was Stephens a 20 odd possession player? Parish was, sure. He was averaging that consistently in his first 2 seasons, Stephens is averaging 11.5

I'm not sh*t-canning Stephens, but the facts don't match this narrative.

Parish played 20 games, but in an average side still emerging from the drug scandal.
He’d have been fringe in a quality side.

I do confess, you’re right about Stephens average possession count in the firsts. I’m just noting that he gets 20-30 in the reserves each week - ultimately that’ll translate to the AFL when he gets a bit stronger.

 

[Punts]

Parish played 20 games, but in an average side still emerging from the drug scandal.
He’d have been fringe in a quality side.

I do confess, you’re right about Stephens average possession count in the firsts. I’m just noting that he gets 20-30 in the reserves each week - ultimately that’ll translate to the AFL when he gets a bit stronger.

How many he get last week?

 

[Dubai Quacker]

How many he get last week?

24

 

[Dan87]

I'd give Ben Long a job I reckon

 

[SGBeach]

Not correct has extended until 2023

yep, just read that. I was going off Footywire. They seem to get alot wrong.
Bummer.. hes gonna be a Gun!

 

[the hypnotoad]

Way there tracking it’s really on Warner and jmac that will be a grade

this is wrong ... gulden, florent are on the way, wicks not far behind, campbell will be, rowbottom (when he's fit) will be
mills, dawson are surely a grade now, or showing enough to know they will be ... blakey is x factor ... and none of that takes into account mcdonald, and arguably amartey and mclean
there's no way i'd pay the money someone like parish would be asking now, and risk not paying enough to keep any of our young rising stars

 

[the hypnotoad]

Big fan of all three and look forward to watching then play the next 200 games for the Swans..
Mills is a very good player, but without looking I imagine theres a few mids of similar age/experince including 3 x bombers.. Merret, McGrath, Parish who have better numbers. How many 'All Australians' will Mills get?
Same can be said about Rowbum and Warner.
You rate those three, Punts rates Warner and JMac, I rate Stephens and Campbell as our best chance of All Australians (thats not to say Mills, Rowbum, Warner, JMac, Florent won't become AA).
Reckon Stephens has the ability to get 30+ and use the ball well. He's very quick and has very good endurance. Hes just undersized at the moment.
Campbell just has fantastic speed and skills!

Post Parker, JPK, Hewett,, I reckon the midfield group is lacking a clean, strong, powerful, 30+ possession winning clearance king. ie. an Elite Inside Mid
If (a big If) Hewett and Parker aren't Swans next year, then Mills will need help. Both Green and Hopper could offer that help.

Not saying we should or shouldn't.. truth is Ive no idea of what the Swans are thinking or what position they're in with the salary cap, or how gettable certain players are. Any midfield changes needs to be put in context with the needs of the back 6, the needs of a Ruck and the needs of a tall forward to replace Buddy and Reid.
Watching the next couple of trade periods with interest.

no, no, no ... what we need is patience, not ONE overpriced, arguably overrated mid from another club ...
this is that same "grass is greener" syndrome i've argued against in the recent past
i would not want one of those hyped essendon players over any of our young players, not the likes of cripps or martin, not green or hopper from GWS ... this is NOT the time to be paying overs to bring in a "name", unless it fills a specific need (key defender - weitering! - or next ruckman) ... this group is on the way, the improvement from last season is dramatic, and no fluke at all ...
i'll say it again, and keep saying it ... keep this group together
dawson must get a new contract, spend money on that, not on some deal to lure a shiny new toy from an overhyped victorian club

 

[SGBeach]

no, no, no ... what we need is patience, not ONE overpriced, arguably overrated mid from another club ...
this is that same "grass is greener" syndrome i've argued against in the recent past
i would not want one of those hyped essendon players over any of our young players, not the likes of cripps or martin, not green or hopper from GWS ... this is NOT the time to be paying overs to bring in a "name", unless it fills a specific need (key defender - weitering! - or next ruckman) ... this group is on the way, the improvement from last season is dramatic, and no fluke at all ...
i'll say it again, and keep saying it ... keep this group together
dawson must get a new contract, spend money on that, not on some deal to lure a shiny new toy from an overhyped victorian club

you say.. "Unless it fills a need"
If Parker and Hewett are not at the Swans next year. We will have a dire need to replace them with at least one very good / elite inside mid. Mills and a slowing JPK will need more help than the young mids can offer next year.
Its all based on Parker and Hewett contracts. All very hypothetical

Im on your side. Develop the crew we've got. The Brisbane List Manager was on 'Road to the Draft' this week (worth a listen), he said "draft for talent, trade for need". Couldn't agree more.
We need a KPD. Melican, Tommy McCartin, OConnor? Paddy McCartin?? Blakey??? How are they tracking? Are you willing to pay top $$ and 2x 1st round picks for Weitering? Dont think I am.

ps. please re-read the last paragraph of my previous post

 

[the hypnotoad]

you say.. "Unless it fills a need"
If Parker and Hewett are not at the Swans next year. We will have a dire need to replace them with at least one very good / elite inside mid. Mills and a slowing JPK will need more help than the young mids can offer next year.
Its all based on Parker and Hewett contracts. All very hypothetical

Im on your side. Develop the crew we've got. The Brisbane List Manager was on 'Road to the Draft' this week (worth a listen), he said "draft for talent, trade for need". Couldn't agree more.
We need a KPD. Melican, Tommy McCartin, OConnor? Paddy McCartin?? Blakey??? How are they tracking? Are you willing to pay top $$ and 2x 1st round picks for Weitering? Dont think I am.

ps. please re-read the last paragraph of my previous post

no, i don't want to pay overs for anyone, so no, i wouldn't pay that for weitering ... but a big key defender is a need (if only to let mccartin become the intercept star he can be) ... so we trade carefully
and i argue we let this core young midfield develop, i argue we don't chase a "name" midfielder, i don't think we need to ... we accommodate inevitable retirements or reduced roles of senior players with the players we've drafted ... florent, mills, warner, heeney, dawson, mcinerney, wicks, gulden, campbell, blakey, rowbottom, hewett ... i'm saying our future elite mids are already there, we just have to keep showing faith and play them
amartey might turnout better than just a forward/backup ruckman option, but ruck is the other need
mcdonald looks the goods ...
this squad is going places

 

[Dubai Quacker]

no, i don't want to pay overs for anyone, so no, i wouldn't pay that for weitering ... but a big key defender is a need (if only to let mccartin become the intercept star he can be) ... so we trade carefully
and i argue we let this core young midfield develop, i argue we don't chase a "name" midfielder, i don't think we need to ... we accommodate inevitable retirements or reduced roles of senior players with the players we've drafted ... florent, mills, warner, heeney, dawson, mcinerney, wicks, gulden, campbell, blakey, rowbottom, hewett ... i'm saying our future elite mids are already there, we just have to keep showing faith and play them
amartey might turnout better than just a forward/backup ruckman option, but ruck is the other need
mcdonald looks the goods ...
this squad is going places

We chased Darcy Moore & then intended to draft DGB.

The club evidently sees a tall defender as a top priority.

I’m just not sure who is in our sights this off season - I really like Ed Richards, but he’s probably not the key position type.

If the salary cap is indeed tight, I suspect we’ll go to the best KPD in the draft.

 

[SGBeach]

We chased Darcy Moore & then intended to draft DGB.

The club evidently sees a tall defender as a top priority.

I’m just not sure who is in our sights this off season - I really like Ed Richards, but he’s probably not the key position type.

If the salary cap is indeed tight, I suspect we’ll go to the best KPD in the draft.

Yep, wouldn't be surprised if we drafted a KPD. Also wouldn't be surprised if Paddy McCartin is on the list next year. And wouldn't be surprised if we traded a young KPD, but wouldn't be surprised if we backed Melican and T McCartin.
Amartey showing good signs and P MaCartin could be 2 extra quality talls that we acquired very cheaply.. Good job Kinnear and team.

Hmmm.. wouldn't be surprised if I was surprised at what the Swans do in the draft / trade period..
Watching with interest..

 

[Membling]

Yep, wouldn't be surprised if we drafted a KPD. Also wouldn't be surprised if Paddy McCartin is on the list next year. And wouldn't be surprised if we traded a young KPD, but wouldn't be surprised if we backed Melican and T McCartin.
Amartey showing good signs and P MaCartin could be 2 extra quality talls that we acquired very cheaply.. Good job Kinnear and team.

Hmmm.. wouldn't be surprised if I was surprised at what the Swans do in the draft / trade period..
Watching with interest..

Always go beat available player in draft. If Gibcus is there, then be a nice win for us.

 

[the hypnotoad]

i have really only seen mclean this year, so not sure what level of athleticism/mobility he has ... and maybe that will improve the longer he's in the system ... but is there any chance he can be tried as a big key defender? does he have that in him? that would be a huge win for us, if we could manufacture a big, strong-marking key defender from within our squad ...

 

[BloodySwan]

Going to be a long rebuild at Collingwood I feel. Go hard for Moore and he solves a big problem for us.

 

[Angry Red Bull]

Going to be a long rebuild at Collingwood I feel. Go hard for Moore and he solves a big problem for us.

Moore has twice used us to lever a better deal with Collingwood, so I wouldn't bother tbh

 

[Bloods86]

Moore has twice used us to lever a better deal with Collingwood, so I wouldn't bother tbh

Also a couple of years he's struggled or hasn't been able to play half the year. 2018 soft tissue and this year PCL. Now he looks to have dealt with the former and the latter might be a one off - but it's worth us thinking about.

 

[Parky79]