List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[Klaatu]

But he's ranked 3rd league wide for marks amongst his cohort that is defenders.

Do you really want to take him out of the backline and still push for finals?

It’s Josh’s decision what the Saints & supporters want will make no difference it’s out of our hands.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[stavro#4]

But he's ranked 3rd league wide for marks amongst his cohort that is defenders.

Do you really want to take him out of the backline and still push for finals?

We average the 5th highest marks per game in the league.

That says more about our style then talent of our playing list and thus that Battle Stat isn’t that impressive

 

[beside the seaside]

But he's ranked 3rd league wide for marks amongst his cohort that is defenders.

Do you really want to take him out of the backline and still push for finals?

If he leaves he'll be a big loss, we will need to be very creative back there to cover it.

The question is though is he worth $950k a year? I'm not sure he is.

If he can get that elsewhere then good on him. He is one player, hopefully he looks back one day and says I wish I'd stayed at the Saints.

 

[Curunir]

If Battle leaves, could Caminiti take over his role next year?

 

[StCicatriz]

If he leaves he'll be a big loss, we will need to be very creative back there to cover it.

The question is though is he worth $950k a year? I'm not sure he is.

If he can get that elsewhere then good on him. He is one player, hopefully he looks back one day and says I wish I'd stayed at the Saints.

I think he is because we end up over paying glorified spuds with minimal output.

For example Gresham was on 800k. How much did we over pay billings and acres for the longest time.

Battle is part of the fabric of the club.

 

[StCicatriz]

If Battle leaves, could Caminiti take over his role next year?

Caminiti issue is his tank and his ability to run out games. Caminiti can replace Howard. He can't replace battle.

 

[Jade Buddha]

If Battle leaves, could Caminiti take over his role next year?

He may need to. I’m not that sold on Hammer as a forward anyway. Would prefer we focused on Developing Keeler in that space.

 

[beside the seaside]

I think he is because we end up over paying glorified spuds with minimal output.

For example Gresham was on 800k. How much did we over pay billings and acres for the longest time.

Battle is part of the fabric of the club.

Fair enough. I reckon there has to be a limit to what any player is worth. But I also love Battle.

 

[StCicatriz]

We average the 5th highest marks per game in the league.

That says more about our style then talent of our playing list and thus that Battle Stat isn’t that impressive

He's still our highest. Howard in comparison on 10 games is ranked 130 something.

Wilkie is incredible in winning one on one's and plays a closer checking role. He's ranked 5th.

You're gonna have to find a guy who can cover the ground and bring down 134 marks to date.

You're not replacing the guy. You'll get a draft pick but you're not replacing that guy easily. Any draftee will take 3 years. We have no one on the list who can do it. So then you're talking about trading someone in which will cost picks.

If he walks our ladder position will suffer next year. We will then be chasing our tail trying to find a replacement for the next 3 years.

 

[stavro#4]

He's still our highest. Howard in comparison on 10 games is ranked 130 something.

Wilkie is incredible in winning one on one's and plays a closer checking role. He's ranked 5th.

You're gonna have to find a guy who can cover the ground and bring down 134 marks to date.

You're not replacing the guy. You'll get a draft pick but you're not replacing that guy easily. Any draftee will take 3 years. We have no one on the list who can do it. So then you're talking about trading someone in which will cost picks.

If he walks our ladder position will suffer next year. We will then be chasing our tail trying to find a replacement for the next 3 years.

No.

The only marking stat that matters for Battle is intercept marking. Battle is currently 11th in the league with 45.

Wilkie is currently 25th with 40 (showing you how tight it is.)

Best in the league is Harris Andrews with 70.


So in short. It’s good. It’s not great.

That’s the entire problem statement here.

It’s 900K + per season to retain.

Those stats are not worth pick 5 on an open market.

 

[g_TRAIN]

Too much talk about Battle.

Hopefully he stays but if he chooses to leave then at least we are in a position to get maximum value.

Doesn't sound like the club wants to lose him and it seems like our contract offer is a substantial one.

Choice is in his hands

 

[BrutThough]

Battle is a good player and I'd like to keep him but the 3rd tall defender is one of the more replaceable positions if we keep the other parts of our defensive structure together.

Enright's track record of getting the best out of his line group also gives me some optimism that we can train up someone to fill 1 hole in the back 7.

If we start getting cute or cut that group any further, thats when I will get worried.

 

[gubby88]

this talk about Battle being a fabric player..

it goes both ways, if he was a fabric player, he would have signed already

its not like hes being low balled

On SM-A156E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[_Maximus_12]

Battle doesn't have an intercept game. Are we watching the same player?

I said Battle doesn’t have an ELITE intercept game. Which you may have missed. Yes he had an intercept game - above average for his position - but not elite which the contract he has in front of him from Hawthorn demands.

Overpaying players because you like them is a fast way to wasting your cap space and limiting your capacity to build a competitive list for a sustained period

 

[BrutThough]

this talk about Battle being a fabric player..

it goes both ways, if he was a fabric player, he would have signed already

its not like hes being low balled

On SM-A156E using BigFooty.com mobile app

Contrast that with Marshall, who publicly got the rumours of him wanting out shut down by the end of the week.

Now that's the actions of a fabric player.

 

[_Maximus_12]

I don’t think anyone is arguing that Battle is valuable. The club has shown that with the reported 5x $800k(ish) contract that’s been tabled to him round 2.

We’d all like to keep him, but not at ANY cost.

Those ignoring the fact the club has an obligation to be responsible with its cap spend are also the same types to ridicule the club for overpaying Billings, Coffield and Gresham in years gone by.

 

[littlecreatures]

But he's ranked 3rd league wide for marks amongst his cohort that is defenders.

Do you really want to take him out of the backline and still push for finals?

As for the salary cap. You have premiership sides that over pay to retain talent all of the time. Hence how McGovern was on over a million a season at wce. The pies had well discussed cap issues. Geelong had salary cap rule breaches but they're also unique in that they have guys like hawkins taking serious pay cuts to keep the group together plus they seem to get guys like Cameron on the cheap. Richmond retained Alex Rance on 800k a year which was huge money at the time.

If you read the previous comment, there’s already been a breakdown provided for his marks. A lot of these are uncontested, he ranks average for intercept marks across the league, which I think tells you what you need to know.

You’re referring to clubs which have had manage their cap to avoid paying overs. Look at either Collingwood or Geelong, ironically who you’ve mentioned. Collingwood got rid of Treloar, Grundy and Stephenson just to manage their cap; Geelong basically offered to drive Stengle down to Moorabbin if we wanted to leave for overs.

I really struggle to see the point you’re making, you’re basically pointing to stats and data which highlights Battle isn’t an elite intercept defender and clubs who have sacrificed to prevent paying overs to manage their cap, all of which reinforces the current management of Battle.

On another note, Rance was an elite intercepting defender, multiple AA, all of which Battle isn’t, once again the point that’s being made. Even McGovern is an elite intercept defender, once again Battle isn’t.

 

[Saint Watto]

I broke my Bahn mi virginity today

I have one and only one question STI.

Did the ground shake ???

Love the cherry emoji.

pop..!!!!!!

The above is off topic so I kept it brief.

 

[Jade Buddha]

Now that LDU chase has gone cold are there any other mids we are chasing (and please don’t say Shiel)?

 

[Saintos The ITK]

Crackling?

Yeah it did actually

 

[Saintos The ITK]

I have one and only one question STI.

Did the ground shake ???

Love the cherry emoji.

pop..!!!!!!

The above is off topic so I kept it brief.

It was good
Good I tell you

 

[Saint Watto]

Battle is part of the fabric of the club.

A little bit of Josh Battle trivia here folks.

Does anyone remember the pic taken of Josh hanging out the drivers window of his bright green VY SS Commodore Sedan.....just after he was drafted in the 2016 draft?

He was copping heaps as his nickname at the time naturally was "Kermit the Frog"

 

[Mr_R0b0t]

McCluggage would have been worth every cent we offered him, accumulator with a taste for goals.

Bingo! Agreed

 

[Saintos The ITK]

Shield would have to be totally free, no trades no picks, Essendon still pay around 75% of his salary and Shield himself be happy to mostly play and guide the young mids at Sandy. If that’s the deal I’m ok with it.

 

[Teflon]

Dumb would be holding our dick and expecting to improve with a bunch of kids and burning your cap space by just forward paying these kids.

Everything needs to be in balance.

Am I advocating for Shiel? No
Do I understand why we would be interested? Yes I can see why he would appeal.

What do I hope we do? Buy big contracts with picks attached and just work our way through that process. But we have very little elder statesmen left if the likely cuts to the list are made.


As I have said a few times in the last 24 hours.

View everything through a balanced mindset.

I look forward to the Shiel contract purchase coming with a plethora of additional picks attached….
That and Dylan sitting in the stands for 12 -15 games …
I’ve not seen 1 skerick of leadership and so called “on field general” traits that Shiel brings that suddenly makes young Bombers walk taller.
I think a balanced mindset also entails being open to the club just simply making a dumb decision and not swallowing or trying to argue that decision away.

Let’s see how this plays out.

Right now it smacks of a desperate cellar dweller just wanting to land someone…..anyone…..and we’ve been down this road with Shiel before….