Analysis Hawthorn rebuild: are they tanking?

[Roddy]

The media conducts the public like a well-tuned orchestra, this is just one of many examples.

Some clickbait and ratings-desperate mouthpiece in the media howls 'Hawthorn are tanking!", and hoards of programmed drones are suddenly also howling 'Hawthorn are tanking!'

As Carlin said, SO many people are utterly incapable of free and critical thought. It's one of the key problems in our societies.

 

[Taper]

The media conducts the public like a well-tuned orchestra, this is just one of many examples.

Some clickbait and ratings-desperate mouthpiece in the media howls 'Hawthorn are tanking!", and hoards of programmed drones are suddenly also howling 'Hawthorn are tanking!'

As Carlin said, SO many people are utterly incapable of free and critical thought. It's one of the key problems in our societies.

I have no doubt the media read this board and threads such as this one to get their material.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

So impressed with Connor MacDonald v the Lions, he looks like an A grade young talent.

Cam McKenzie could be even better.

Hawks have better kids than we all thought, putting my hand up and admitting I was wrong about them and their prospects.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I kid you not

View attachment 1710696

I was a very early voter, for the LOL’s.

 

[Back One Out]

Didn't realise he's 24. But yeah he's an absolute wrecking ball without doubt. The only thing for me is footy smarts and ball use. If he can take those areas of his game to the next level, it will be hard to not give him a spot. My gut feeling though is one of Stephens and Long will take over that big-bodied brute role for us in the future. Will depend on how they progress though of course.

Mate... It was only a year or two ago that most Hawks fans cringed when they saw Nash's name in the selected team.
The general consensus was that he had no fricken idea how to play footy and that he'd be delisted. His improvement over the past 18 months has been ENORMOUS. One of the most improved players in the comp.

He's a 197cm athletic beast who can run and tackle all day long. Not just the best athlete in our team, but he is also a good character and a hard worker. He has become a permanent fixture of our midfield. I can't see that changing over the next 4 or 5 years. Who knows how much further he can improve?

If Stephens or Long can step up, great, the more the merrier. There is no singular "big-bodied brute role". Look at the strong bodies Geelong had last year: Danger, Blicavs, Selwood, Duncan, Guthrie, Tuohy, Smith... Melbourne with Petracca, Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Harmes, Langdon... Or what about Freo's strong midfield from 2012-2015 that went close to winning a flag: Fyfe, Mundy, Barlow, De Boer, Mzungu, Neale, S.Hill

It's better to have six meat-axes who can smash through tackles & smash opponents than six small guys who get dominated in the contests.

 

[DrAbs]

So impressed with Connor MacDonald v the Lions, he looks like an A grade young talent.

Cam McKenzie could be even better.

Hawks have better kids than we all thought, putting my hand up and admitting I was wrong about them and their prospects.

I had Carlton taking CMac in the 2021 draft.. I never thought we'd take him with literally the pick before you guys. I'm glad we did though, looks like a steal.

 

[Kanga Commando]

I was a very early voter, for the LOL’s.

You are kiddng

Own your work

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

You are kiddng

Own your work

I just did.

It’s a poll that means nothing, from a nuffy opposition poster who started this thread.

 

[Denver Day Lewis]

View attachment 1709885

View attachment 1709885

Returning their merchandise now that their season is offically over?

 

[SSSSSS]

Still fielding by far the youngest team in the comp week in and week out.

Riding the bumps with a grin.

 

[Zevon]

I’m sorry folks but how on earth did a thread about Hawthorn’s rebuild get to being a debate about wokeness? Never change BigFooty

If you check in to find your post has been edited or deleted, it was either:
a) off topic
b) miles off topic, or
c) abusive towards other posters

Further posts that have nothing to do with Hawthorn’s rebuild will be removed too, so let’s get back on track yeah?

 

[naysayer]

Does this thread really have a topic?

Is rebuilding simply a form of tanking? Discuss.

 

[AlwaysHawks15]

Unlike alot of other media people Stevie J I believe is still in the game in a coaching capacity. I tend to listen when he has opinions.

Has a shitload of respect for Hawthorn. He played against Mitchell multiple times and would know we have the right coach to take us back up the ladder. Think you will find most former Cats players from that era of when we were both great teams have the same opinion. ( Except Chapman who's a flog).

 

[DrAbs]

This is aging as well as milk being left in the hot sun.

It brightens my day that a West Coast supporter of all clubs should make it as well. I would have thought deliberately playing a WAFL team in the AFL might come under greater scrutiny, especially with a coach who couldn't care less what is happening and is laughing all the way through.

HAHA a West Coast supporter of all clubs that's hilarious

 

[DrAbs]

Mate... It was only a year or two ago that most Hawks fans cringed when they saw Nash's name in the selected team.
The general consensus was that he had no fricken idea how to play footy and that he'd be delisted. His improvement over the past 18 months has been ENORMOUS. One of the most improved players in the comp.

He's a 197cm athletic beast who can run and tackle all day long. Not just the best athlete in our team, but he is also a good character and a hard worker. He has become a permanent fixture of our midfield. I can't see that changing over the next 4 or 5 years. Who knows how much further he can improve?

If Stephens or Long can step up, great, the more the merrier. There is no singular "big-bodied brute role". Look at the strong bodies Geelong had last year: Danger, Blicavs, Selwood, Duncan, Guthrie, Tuohy, Smith... Melbourne with Petracca, Oliver, Viney, Brayshaw, Harmes, Langdon... Or what about Freo's strong midfield from 2012-2015 that went close to winning a flag: Fyfe, Mundy, Barlow, De Boer, Mzungu, Neale, S.Hill

It's better to have six meat-axes who can smash through tackles & smash opponents than six small guys who get dominated in the contests.

If he continues to keep performing and growing he would be in the team. But if not, I reckon a few guys could overtake him tbf. It's not a dig at Nashy, it's just a show of the depth of midfield talent we have. Anyone who doesn't get up might get squeezed out. The same applies to Jimmy Worpel mind you.

Also, I never said you can't have multiple big bodied mids.. but the best midfields have a balance between big and smaller midfields as you've just mentioned already. Which completely deteriorates your argument to begin with lol. "Six small guys" doesn't determine how good a player can be. Height can be advantageous sure, but have too much of it and you're gonna have the "small guys" bursting through the middle with speed that will likely not be matched by a team of giants.

Btw you do realise not all those mids fit the "big bodied" mould. Danger, Blicavs (who's not rly a midfielder), and Tuohy (maybe just). Clearly they're not all big bodied. It's like comparing Tuohy to Bontempelli..

Petracca yes, Oliver yes, Viney (bull but not big in terms of height), Brayshaw (maybe), Harmes, Langdon NO NO wtf?

Fyfe yes, Mundy yes, Barlow yes, De Boer probably, Mzungu, Neale, Hill.... bruhh are you ok? They're not big bodied at all lol

 

[hawkman]

Afl hq now trying to facilitate the tank by sending Sicily to tribunal

After facilitating the tank by suspending Day which potentially cost wins against Adelaide and GWS

 

[Art Vandelay_]

EAD Damian Barrett

His hot take today is some of the most laughable crap lol.

After a sample size of checks notes half a season has declared he believes Butters, Rozee and Horne-Francis can reach the revered territory of famed midfield dynasties Aker, Voss, Black and Judd, Kerr, Cousins... Left out the Cats/Hawks flag midfields so guess those Port boys are already superior.

 

[SSSSSS]

Gunston is cooked.

Jaeger doing ok at Freo but would be behind all of Nash, Day, Newcombe and Worpel. Much happier with Meek. Was one of our best against Brisbane.

Mitchell is playing much better in a team that can use him as the #1 clearance mid and with players to dish it off to. Would be wasted on a half forward flank at the Hawks.

EAD Barrett you ****wit.

 

[WWSD]

Gunston is cooked.

Jaeger doing ok at Freo but would be behind all of Nash, Day, Newcombe and Worpel. Much happier with Meek. Was one of our best against Brisbane.

Mitchell is playing much better in a team that can use him as the #1 clearance mid and with players to dish it off to. Would be wasted on a half forward flank at the Hawks.

EAD Barrett you *******.

Worpel is in career best form again and is arguably playing better this year than O’Meara.

The emergence of Nash and Day as midfielders has been largely due to them seeing more time in the midfield.

Fergus Greene has kicked the same amount of goals as Gunston despite playing less games.

Shiels and Howe haven’t really had that much of an impact at North Melbourne.

Hawthorn is up in contested possessions, clearances and centre clearances compared to what it was last year. It’s functioning much better overall with none of the Hawthorn midfielders being over 24.

With more players likely to be added as part of the new-look midfield rotation, there’s plenty of upside.

No mention of any of that by anyone in the media.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Gunston is cooked.

I queried if he was last year, as he couldn’t get separation.
He kicked something like 11 goals against the top 10 sides for the year, and filled his boots against the Roos and Suns.

Still wanted him to stick around though, as we could have used him, particularly when Lewis was injured.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Worpel is in career best form again and is arguably playing better this year than O’Meara.

I don’t think it’s even an argument.

Worpel is equal 4th for average centre clearances with Oliver, Laird and Anderson.

He’s having a career best year.

 

[Roby]

Hawthorn wanted to keep Gunston.

 

[Jhye Clark 13]

Hawks have better kids than we all thought, putting my hand up and admitting I was wrong about them and their prospects.

Speak for yourself.

 

[Dewyyyyy]

Speak for yourself.

Shut up, Jhye Clark can’t tie the laces of anyone in our midfield x

 

[peetoo]

Worpel is in career best form again and is arguably playing better this year than O’Meara.

The emergence of Nash and Day as midfielders has been largely due to them seeing more time in the midfield.

Fergus Greene has kicked the same amount of goals as Gunston despite playing less games.

Shiels and Howe haven’t really had that much of an impact at North Melbourne.

Hawthorn is up in contested possessions, clearances and centre clearances compared to what it was last year. It’s functioning much better overall with none of the Hawthorn midfielders being over 24.

With more players likely to be added as part of the new-look midfield rotation, there’s plenty of upside.

No mention of any of that by anyone in the media.

And the 1000 plus games lost to the club will be average when the years 2021 and 2023 trade and drafting are combined with it. I reckon every club loses on average 500 games each off season