Ross Lyon's job under threat?

[UrLordUnbeliever]

It's a question that should be considered though..
The playing group are collectively mentally struggling and are finding it harder to dig deep enough to eke out a win..
They have lost their self-belief and self confidence that were instrumental in getting over the top of sides, and frankly a new coach would revitalise them, and they'd probably relish the chance to take a game on with no expectations, play attacking football..

 

[TheGreatBarryB]

The guy was a toe tap and a bad bounce away from being a 2-time premiership coach. Give him a break.

 

[kirky]

ive been interested to see how this pans out.
Last team that lost two grand finals in a row was collingwood in 02/03 and they tailed off. The mental fatigue (add to that the fact they've failed to win 3 in a row) has to start taking effect.

they're next 4 games are against two bogey teams in essendon and carlton and 2 interstate trips.
And they do it all without Hayes, who along with Dal Santo and Blake are the only ones really firing. Question for the saints is:
Without Riewoldt dominating, Goddard, Milne, Gilbert and Montagna at their best and Kosi and schneider on the sideline, where to do they turn to.
Their top 10 has always been unquestionably good, but its the depth after that that is being tested at the moment and it doesnt stand up.

Baker, Gamble, Gwilt, Gram, Peake, Ray, Clarke, Dawson, Dempster were all pretty ineffective.
Top ball winners tonight were Armitage and Milne and neither broke the game open

Very good points.

The problem for the Saints is their double up games this year are against Collingwood, Fremantle, Adelaide, Carlton, Geelong and North Melbourne.

No easy beats in any of those. They now have played Richmond for the season and next week face one of their nemesis, Essendon. If they are 0-2-1 after 3, they will be in serious trouble and a top 4 spot is looking very shaky.

The loss of Hayes may be crucial.

 

[CFC16]

I don't think even the staunchest of St Kilda fans can argue that the club plays ugly footy. It's been tolerated to this point because they've managed to get some results, but is Ross Lyon's tenure now finally under threat??

For how long will this be tolerated at the Saints?

They should have put the Cats away last week... and didn't (in one of the ugliest games of all time)

They should have put the Tigers away tonight... and are currently engaged in another ugly arm wrestle.

With all due respect to Richmond - a club that has come along in leaps and bounds in the last year - the Saints should be beating this team by four or five goals.

I might be going prematurely with this thread, but even if the Saints prevail tonight, it will be a fortunate escape. Whatever the outcome, it's undeniable that St Kilda is playing atrocious football and when will the club say "enough is enough"?

You idiot

 

[kitchendweller]

I wanted to reply to this thread but it seems the less clue you have the more you can say, I may have unlocked the key to BF.

 

[Brasil2007]

It's a question that should be considered though..
The playing group are collectively mentally struggling and are finding it harder to dig deep enough to eke out a win..
They have lost their self-belief and self confidence that were instrumental in getting over the top of sides, and frankly a new coach would revitalise them, and they'd probably relish the chance to take a game on with no expectations, play attacking football..

I agree, and I said before the game that I thought if the Saints lost that the drums would start softly beating at St Kilda. I listen to SEN and I hear caller after caller ask where the improvement is coming from. There are no kids and while they've picked up some handy players from elsewhere you'd have to say that by and large they haven't done all that well from the blokes they've picked up: its still Roo, Milne, Goddard, Dal, Lenny, etc that do the heavy lifting week in week out.

I wonder if the Sydney model used by the Saints can work for a Melbourne team, too.

The Saints board (different board I know) got rid of Thomas and he was pretty successful without winning the ultimate prize.

 

[grogan]

I think we'd be more worried about him giving us the sack!

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

Holy crap is this thread for real hahahha if Lyon job is apparently under "threat" for making 3 grand finals in a row then the rest of the league coaches will be sacked come monday morning.

 

[Rod Stroker]

Holy crap is this thread for real hahahha if Lyon job is apparently under "threat" for making 3 grand finals in a row then the rest of the league coaches will be sacked come monday morning.

You're forgetting this is Saint Failure. Stan Alves took them to their first GF in eons, was given the flick the very next year. Culture.

 

[Brasil2007]

Interesting point to note is that in a squillion years of footy (571 games) Malthouse has only had six draws. Ross has coached 100 games (why no mention on the banner btw?) and had four draws.

I think the culture, etc, etc, arguments are all bs. The board will look at whether Lyon is the best man to take the club forward next year. He might well be, but then if the possibility comes to get Mick Malthouse, Bomber Thompson or Paul Roos the board would be crazy not to at least consider it.

 

[Heeney2Franklin]

I agree, and I said before the game that I thought if the Saints lost that the drums would start softly beating at St Kilda. I listen to SEN and I hear caller after caller ask where the improvement is coming from. There are no kids and while they've picked up some handy players from elsewhere you'd have to say that by and large they haven't done all that well from the blokes they've picked up: its still Roo, Milne, Goddard, Dal, Lenny, etc that do the heavy lifting week in week out.

I wonder if the Sydney model used by the Saints can work for a Melbourne team, too.

The Saints board (different board I know) got rid of Thomas and he was pretty successful without winning the ultimate prize.

They never would of won a flag under Thomas gameplan basically because they didnt have a Premiership capable defence sure it would look good when they flogged mid-low class sides with full out attacks but against teams with strong forwards they got smashed.

 

[mysainters]

I sincerley hope not.

I read hundreds of posts on here all the time about how we have superstars at the top of our list, and it then quickly falls away.

Despite that, he had a crack at a couple of flags.

Now his job's under threat?

So which is it, can't have it both ways.

 

[Brilliant]

He may be under some pressure to change the game plan. It's only SEN but alot of Saints fans are getting frustrated at having to watch that crap. The gameplan is uninspiring and they have gone with "Saints don't try to win, they try not to lose"

All the draws and close finishes back up this sentiment.

He is gone if he can't change the gameplan while maintaining success.

 

[Brasil2007]

They never would of won a flag under Thomas gameplan basically because they didnt have a Premiership capable defence sure it would look good when they flogged mid-low class sides with full out attacks but against teams with strong forwards they got smashed.

I don't disagree with that either. I don't think Thomas was a good coach: he was very good at putting out a team that could make the finals but his finals record was terrible and unlikely to improve.

 

[mysainters]

He may be under some pressure to change the game plan. It's only SEN but alot of Saints fans are getting frustrated at having to watch that crap. The gameplan is uninspiring and they have gone with "Saints don't try to win, they try not to lose"

All the draws and close finishes back up this sentiment.

He is gone if he can't change the gameplan while maintaining success.

See, do people even watch before commenting?

We had 30 shots on goal tonight, surely that's trying to win it.

Two weeks in a row we've moved the ball quicker, and had 50+ entries into the F50.

Our skills are just super ordinary.

This week the story for mine was set shots, 6.11, I mean come on.

 

[Brasil2007]

I sincerley hope not.

I read hundreds of posts on here all the time about how we have superstars at the top of our list, and it then quickly falls away.

Despite that, he had a crack at a couple of flags.

Now his job's under threat?

So which is it, can't have it both ways.

To be clear I don't think anyone's saying his job is under threat. It's more that his job could quickly be under threat.

I don't think your points are mutually exclusive: he's done well to get the team into 2 (3?) grand finals. To do it at times he's had to play a type of football that a lot of people don't like much because he doesn't have the depth that some other teams have. The question the board might ask though is where the improvement will come from and whether a different coach with a different philosophy might bring success to the club.

Nobody can afford to stand still in footy.

 

[Rough_Edges]

We had 30 shots on goal tonight.

I'm not sure why people are saying we were defensive tonight?

I thought we were fairly attacking and if we had of kicked straight could've really kicked a big score.

Alas, we didn't.

 

[Brasil2007]

We had 30 shots on goal tonight.

I'm not sure why people are saying we were defensive tonight?

I thought we were fairly attacking and if we had of kicked straight could've really kicked a big score.

Alas, we didn't.

I agree, I didn't think you played especially defensively, except for a few short periods in the game. You could have easily kicked 120 or more points - a lot of the misses were from 30-40 out (or closer).

 

[Kopout]

Still don't believe me?

Sure - the majority of his senior players are horribly underdone and out of form, but;

1) Does this not reflect poor preparation for 2011?
2) He's still being out-coached by admittedly a great player, who is coaching just his third game.

What happened to 'Saints Footy' - the notorious attack on the man and the ball that made them a near unbeatable force throughout 2009-10? It was rare for teams to put up 80 points in an entire game and the Bombers have it in a half with no sign of abatement.

I'm calling it. Saints are done. If they make the finals, they'll sneak in to 6-8 and limp home quietly. This group will not win a flag and Ross Lyon will be gone in the next 12-18 months.

Things don't get any easier for St Kilda either, with a horrendous run between Rounds 6-13:

Adelaide away
Carlton
Hawthorn
Melbourne
Fremantle away
Collingwood
Western
Geelong

 

[HyperAgressiveDonk]

St Kilda are finished. Too old, too slow, players like Goddard and a few others have been found out.

They need to rebuild, but have no youth coming through. Stick a fork in them for the next decade, they're done!

 

[beez]

Lack of anything other than Riewoldt in the forward line is killing them.

 

[jerry springer]

They remind me a lot of us in 2004. Mentally shot.

this.

They are finished.Need to be very smart in the trading and recruiting game now.Not really a strength of Lyon however

 

[kirky]

Still have double ups against Freo, Collingwood, Roos, Carlton and Adelaide with another Geelong game to come.

Mentally shattered and season is looking gone.

This will be is Lyon's greatest test.

Happy to be proven wrong, but with exception of Hayes they are full strength or have a very small injury list?

 

[jerry springer]

they could always make a documentry about beating Brisbane next week

 

[AndSmithMustScore]

Losing a player like Hayes would hurt most clubs around their mark.