Review Round 20 = Collingwood 76-93 Carlton

[Roverjg]

Some people just can’t be objective after a loss. Thankfully we’ve only had a grand total of 3 of them. 3…

You are right 3. We had plenty of chances but we were poor on the night. However the teams that beat us are in the 8 and they each closed the corridor and beat us at our own pressure game. It would have been more than 3 if other teams had not kicked poorly. The sky is not falling but it is not cloudless either.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[frizzle]

Horrible hack kick from Bianco from defense causes the turnover that costs the team a goal. Kick dribbled along the ground instead of clearing the defense.

 

[stormskye]

You are right 3. We had plenty of chances but we were poor on the night. However the teams that beat us are in the 8 and they each closed the corridor and beat us at our own pressure game. It would have been more than 3 if other teams had not kicked poorly. The sky is not falling but it is not cloudless either.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

You could say this about every single top team. All the top teams have been found out plenty of times.

 

[Vicky Park]

Not sure if it's been mentioned, but Vicky Park has to wear some responsibility for what happened last night.

In pre-game, she pretty much booked us in for the flag.

She was 'careful' to clarify that this wasn't the beginning of a dynasty, but at least the 2023 premiership was in the bank.

I don't claim to have personal rapport with the divinities but I know that they like to have fun with human 'destiny', especially when it's draped in black and white.

Those who've been around long enough to remember when Carlton were relevant should know better.

 

[LuckyLee]

Some people just can’t be objective after a loss. Thankfully we’ve only had a grand total of 3 of them. 3…

And some people are too quick to dismiss structural/selection flaws and poor effort/attitude/skills as “bad luck” or “just not our night”, etc.

Geelong, Brisbane and Essendon would all have no fear going into their respective matches with us in coming weeks. Every team in the hunt believes we’re gettable.

We’re now back in the pack of 4-5 contenders. We can definitely still win it but we are no longer clear favourites.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[swoop42]

Contested Ball Stats 2023.

Collingwood vs Opponent

Rd 1 135 to 130 Geelong (+5)
Rd 2 155 to 98 Port Adelaide (+57)
Rd 3 161 to 139 Richmond (+22)
Rd 4 136 to 137 Brisbane (-1) Loss 33pts
Rd 5 126 to 147 St Kilda (-21) Win 6pts
Rd 6 142 to 121 Essendon (+21)
Rd 7 143 to 143 Adelaide (0)
Rd 8 138 to 129 Sydney (+9)
Rd 9 125 to 130 Greater Western Sydney (-5) Win 65pts
Rd 10 131 to 127 Carlton (+4)
Rd 11 127 to 124 North Melbourne (+3)
Rd 12 124 to 132 West Coast (-8) Win 63pts
Rd 13 120 to 139 Melbourne (-19) Loss 4pts
Rd 15 134 to 137 Adelaide (-3) Win 2pts
Rd 16 146 to 119 Gold Coast (+27)
Rd 17 115 to 132 Western Bulldogs (-17) Win 12pts
Rd 18 135 to 134 Fremantle (+1)
Rd 19 148 to 140 Port Adelaide (+8)
Rd 20 109 to 142 Carlton (-33) Loss 17pts

Lowest contested ball total for the year last night and the largest differential.

 

[stormskye]

And some people are too quick to dismiss structural/selection flaws and poor effort/attitude/skills as “bad luck” or “just not our night”, etc.

Geelong, Brisbane and Essendon would all have no fear going into their respective matches with us in coming weeks. Every team in the hunt believes we’re gettable.

We’re now back in the pack of 4-5 contenders. We can definitely still win it but we are no longer clear favourites.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

And yet all the other top teams have lost more games, and had bad days as well. So I don’t fear any of them either. Btw, geel are barely beating freo at home…

We were never ahead of the pack. We’ve always been 1 of 5 teams that can win it.

 

[LuckyLee]

And yet all the other top teams have lost more games, and had bad days as well. So I don’t fear any of them either. Btw, geel are barely beating freo at home…

We were never ahead of the pack. We’ve always been 1 of 5 teams that can win it.

I have no doubt our best footy is good enough to lift the Cup. But we haven’t been in consistently good form for ages. We’ve been getting it done in bursts but haven’t been able to deliver four quarters of dominance.

And despite being blessed with so few injuries, we still have little idea what our best line-up looks like. And last night made that question even more confusing, with Cox a liability and Howe only having an influence after he was moved to full forward.

Are we one ruck or two? Johnson or Cox or both? Howe or Frampton or both? Hoskin-Elliott or Hill or Ginnivan?


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[ksardog]

Watching McStay late in the ruck and we just cannot do him as even a temporary ruckman, he’s hopeless in that position.

If Cox is insistent on lumbering way off his opponents and losing ruck contests to forwards then Frampton really is the only option unless Cameron can effectively play 95% game time like Grundy used to.

I don’t want us to fall in the trap of using McStay as a pinch hit ruck, have zero confidence in that.

 

[Didak Wine]

Re watched the game. Mcreerys sitter, in the 2nd there's two holding decisions could have been paid in centre clearance degoey being held and cerra being held in 2 different duels at same time, whistle blows degoey goes to take the free certain gets it carlton goal results, decision against cox for nothing, Elliot goal not allowed when there's a clear angle showing ball wasn't touched. We miss a few shots that last week we were scoring, elliots mark of the year sprays it. Play them again next week and I reckon we would win.

 

[ksardog]

Beat Port twice and 2nd on the ladder, beat Cats who the media are still licking their ass and the team to beat apparently, beat Dogs at Marvel who are on, beat Adelaide twice who are going well, won interstate clash convincingly

Give it a rest, we need work still and team seems to rotate a lot and not settled.

Concern is that we have the slowest mids in the AFL and need JDG & Daicos to play well all the time

Pendles
Adams
Lippa
Mitchell
Sidebottom

We need to improve our field kicking, centre clearances are killing us and work on how we solve those kick in from points, we need to stop walking away from the mark and give the opposition time and space

Lastly - Hill AJ & Frampton need to be best 23

wouldn’t mind seeing Elliott have a few goes through the midfield. Been great up forward, but we need to generate some pace and tackling pressure in the middle. Can’t have a combination of Pendles, Mitchell and Adams in there . Naicos to go to half back , with a run each qtr through the centre. ideally Would want most of his possessions forward of centre, but we need him getting 30 plus times for us to be at our most dangerous

 

[Didak Wine]

Seriously though, that Elliot goal there's a gap between ball and fingers and they showed the footage.

 

[anshell]

Seriously though, that Elliot goal there's a gap between ball and fingers and they showed the footage.

Yes,that was a shocking decision,It seemed like the goal reviewer was too timid to over rule the goal umpire in that case.

 

[jakson68]

I took the night and today to reflect before commenting on the loss, though I can sum up my feelings as this.
You have to want and Carlton wanted it more than us last night.

I am disappointed with the loss, as would us all but seriously, couldn't we all see it coming?

Collingwood were two games and % clear on top and Carlton needed to keep winning to keep their season alive.
I think if we are lucky enough to meet again during the final series, when it matters to both teams, the outcome will be different.
We had our chances but failed to capitalize on the moments.
That being said Carlton were the better team on the night but even the sun shines on a dogs arse some days.
Don't be disheartened guys, we are better than that, we are better than them.
I just think we had one eye on September, though I feel this may have been the touch up we required, to get our head back in the game and realize things don't just happen.
You have to want!

 

[3rdMan]

What’s our weakness up fwd?

Form of Cox, and you could now include Mihocek.

Outside of form, Cox is still not an ideal forward, just doesn't move well enough, but I don't think we have an ideal mix if we also want a second ruck.

 

[3rdMan]

I’m not sure we took much away more so than “played our way” better and applied actual pressure

Not sure I saw much pressure being applied on the Blues yesterday

We took away Weitering's intercept marking last night. He had 9 total marks in the first half, just 2 in the second half. De Goey played a defensive role on Cripps and beat him. We're always going to do something to take away what the opposition wants to do.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

Seriously though, that Elliot goal there's a gap between ball and fingers and they showed the footage.

Disagree the footage was inconclusive, it was the original umpire’s call which screwed us.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Not sure if it’s been mentioned earlier…

Since our bye, in the last 34 days (24 June to 28 July) Collingwood played 6 games averaging one game every 5.6 days.

In our next 28 days Collingwood will play 4 games with a 7 day average.

Fatigue impacts decision making and execution. It also negatively impacts your ability to apply pressure.

Last night we had our worst contested possession performance of the year with only 108. The week before vs Port we had one of our best contested ball performances with 148.

In the back of my mind is what Cam Mooney said years ago about the Cats. When games ahead up top, they’d have a 3-4 week heavy training load starting about round 8. They’d then do it again in July to peak for September.

Credit to Carlton, last night they played better than us and walked away 17 point winners. However, Carlton don’t have the luxury we have, like the Cats in the mooney era to ramp up training loads as the Blues have to win every game just to make finals.

We looked like a tired team last night. A team that had just played 6 games in 34 days. A team that after the Port win (it was effectively a 2 win game) wasn’t as motivated and was more looking fwd to seeing the end of July which has been very taxing.

Despite the heavy loads and number of games, we went 5-1 in this period. We also had opportunities to beat Carlton last night even though we were cooked. That’s extremely encouraging to me when we are looking forward to September.

I don’t see Collingwood putting up 108 contested possessions again this year, nor in a final. Our best pressure game in 2022 was also in the qualifying final.

As the last two quality coaches of this club have implied, it’s a marathon not a sprint. With 4 games in 28 days coming up, then a week off before first final - I think we are still in great position to win 16.

With more rest and less training loads our pressure, contested possession, decision making and execution will improve greatly.

I still believe we are timing our run to September as planned. McRae focusing on, and getting thru, July makes much more sense if you read between the lines at what he was actually emphasising.






Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

Great post and context!

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Regarding our potential "flatness" last night in response to the tough game against Port the week before I will be watching with interest how Port come up against the Crows tonight. If they too look flat and tired and put in a stinker I will feel some vindication that last night was an aberration and just one to forget. Will be very interesting.

Don't forget Port got absolutely smashed by Blues the week prior...

 

[ElliottsMaggies]

Seriously though, that Elliot goal there's a gap between ball and fingers and they showed the footage.

David Rodan would have paid it as a goal.

 

[3rdMan]

Reflecting on the game again today, it really wasn't much different to many others. We again put ourselves in a position to win. Should have done much more damage in the 3rd and similar in the last. We stopped their intercept marking and got the game on our terms for the second half (Weitering 2 total marks), it was mainly the 2nd quarter that was poor.

It's not always the case with poor kicking, but I'm confident in saying we were just off last night. I disagree it was Carlton's pressure. We took 18 marks inside 50 to 10, so we were getting the ball where it needed to be, just didn't execute. Given these were often set shots, it's on us, not Carlton.

There are definitely things to work on but they are not new. Mainly we give the oppo too much of a look at it when they are able to get the ball forward. We are the best defensive side, but that's mainly due to reducing inside 50s by aggressive defence. When it gets in we can allow easy goals and did that again last night. Unfortunately many of them were from frees in this case.

 

[ThePhantom777]

Don't forget Port got absolutely smashed by Blues the week prior...

Port rested a bunch of players

 

[JLC]

We almost morphed into the early season Carlton with our terrible goal kicking. They used to miss their snapshots, last night it was us.

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

 

[sr36]

Some people just can’t be objective after a loss. Thankfully we’ve only had a grand total of 3 of them. 3…

I thought we were pretty good in the second half, but blew our chances up forward and Carlton got a bit lucky up their end.

The concerns:
Looks like teams have learnt to load up around the contest to stifle our run.

And to almost play our tall defenders like forwards with early aggressive body contact.

Midfield pace

Overall
Because we've been the best, our style has been targeted. We'll need to make some tweaks. Good time to find out.

 

[The Royal Sampler]

We almost morphed into the early season Carlton with our terrible goal kicking. They used to miss their snapshots, last night it was us.

Sent from my Pixel 7 Pro using Tapatalk

Our pressure was shit, so that tends to be the result.