Certified Legendary Thread Sack Hinkley 12 - Finals Are Scary

[dirty2]

I don't know.... But if the board/football committee ect are thinking Hinkley's isn't the man for the job then that's the answer for them.

None of this if he wins he's In.. or if he losses by 21.5 points or less we will keep him..

All just a load of shit.

 

[Chad WinGOAT]

I understand Koch's comments are annoying and ill timed given he has been held back all season long. But given the amount of contract lying to journos faces from players, coaches and now board members, there's no need to go in hard over it.

Everyone needs to take a chill pill.

The board has always publicly taken the stance of being fully behind Kenny. For optics purposes it’s important as no one can blame the board for lack of support or resources etc.

I think it’s important to remind everyone that whilst Koch is the chairman he doesn’t make the decision on the coach. We have established this already. The footy committee makes the call. The board ratify the decision. It’s actually not Koch's place to say his position is under threat as no official footy review has been conducted by the footy committee. You might as well have asked a random fan off the street for their opinion, it would have had just much as weight.

I view it as a free hit to publicly back Kenny without actually verifying anything. Much like Kenny saying in his press conference before the Hawks game saying "the facts are I'm contracted for next season", this is effectively the same thing from the boards perspective.

Kenny has had all the media on him leading into the game and its clear the club let that happen. Now that Kenny has stopped the rot of losing finals, they will back him in for a prelim win. If he loses, the heat will turn back on and they can still fire him pending a footy committee review.

 

[GremioPower]

The footy committee makes the call.

And that’s also a problem.

 

[longdonkey]

I'm not sure I agree with your notion that his future riding on this game is soooo wrong as you put it. In a vacuum, potentially. But at the end of the day, he needs to win the big games.

In my opinion the history is strong enough and no matter what happens on Friday night there is a strong case that Ken is no longer and hasn't been the best person to lead the club for some time.

I don't know who is doing what, but its obvious to see that Ken has relinquished some responsibilities and there hasn't been a downturn in performance.

We beat up enough teams out of the 8 when we get an easier draw based on the performance of the best 10 players to make finals, take them out of the team or we play top 8 teams our performance does not hold up.

When we make the finals its obvious to see that we cannot match the best teams unless everything goes right for us. Hawthorn was an aberration and in my opinion Hawthorn were more hype than Hollywood. If we can beat Sydney I'm more than happy to be proven wrong but I think list management have more to do with the reason why we make finals and in general our coaching is the reason why we lose finals. I know its sounds like I'm cherry picking but that is in my opinion the hard truth.

 

[papahuggey]

I appreciate the last few posts but my concern is that unfortunately it appears there is weight to what Kochie says. I refer to last year and the 'August deadline'.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[tribey]

I appreciate the last few posts but my concern is that unfortunately it appears there is weight to what Kochie says. I refer to last year and the 'August deadline'.

On SM-N975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

Port could lose by 100 points and he’s not going to accept a recommendation to sack — if there is one — and have to weather the ensuing firestorm from everyone who has ever conceded the last tinned spaghetti toastie to him at Fitzroy and Geelong.

 

[Bevoman]

Port could lose by 100 points and he’s not going to accept a recommendation to sack — if there is one — and have to weather the ensuing firestorm from everyone who has ever conceded the last tinned spaghetti toastie to him at Fitzroy and Geelong.

Move on, he will coach out his contract for next year.

 

[tribey]

Move on, he will coach out his contract for next year.

Precisely my point, I thought.

 

[Chewy316]

In my opinion the history is strong enough and no matter what happens on Friday night there is a strong case that Ken is no longer and hasn't been the best person to lead the club for some time.

I don't know who is doing what, but its obvious to see that Ken has relinquished some responsibilities and there hasn't been a downturn in performance.

We beat up enough teams out of the 8 when we get an easier draw based on the performance of the best 10 players to make finals, take them out of the team or we play top 8 teams our performance does not hold up.

When we make the finals its obvious to see that we cannot match the best teams unless everything goes right for us. Hawthorn was an aberration and in my opinion Hawthorn were more hype than Hollywood. If we can beat Sydney I'm more than happy to be proven wrong but I think list management have more to do with the reason why we make finals and in general our coaching is the reason why we lose finals. I know its sounds like I'm cherry picking but that is in my opinion the hard truth.

Port's record against teams in the top 8 this year is 6-4. For context, Sydney's is 7-3, Brisbane's is 5-5 and Geelong's is 6-5. So based on this season at least I can't agree with the idea that Port capitulate against the top teams relative to their competitors. In previous years (especially around 2017) they absolutely could not beat teams in the top 8, but that imo hasn't been a problem for quite some years.

I would also challenge you to take the best 10 players out of any team and see how the remainder of the team performs against good sides. You're drawing some pretty long bows there which are purely subjective.

Hawthorn had the #1 offence and #1 defence since round 9 of this season. Won 15 of their past 19 games heading into last Friday night by an average of 45 points. They are a really good team and one can't simply overlook them and be dismissive of the win.

If Port win on Friday night, Ken deserves a lot of credit. Can't say that getting a team to a grand final is purely because of sound list management.

 

[MrMeaner]

If Port win on Friday night, Ken deserves a lot of credit. Can't say that getting a team to a grand final is purely because of sound list management.

Perhaps. I still think we are relying too much on fanatical chaos and would be far better if the effort was coupled with better structure. We will never get that with Hinkley.

 

[Chewy316]

Perhaps. I still think we are relying too much on fanatical chaos and would be far better if the effort was coupled with better structure. We will never get that with Hinkley.

Don't conflate the two ideas.

1) Hinkley deserves credit if they make it to a grand final
2) the Club can do better than Hinkley as its senior coach.

Both statements can be true.

 

[tribey]

Perhaps. I still think we are relying too much on fanatical chaos and would be far better if the effort was coupled with better structure. We will never get that with Hinkley.

Geelong @ KP: W by 6
Hawthorn @ AO: W by 1
Carlton @ AO: L by 36
GWS @ SHO: L by 22
Brisbane @ AO: L by 79
Bulldogs @ AO: W by 48
Carlton @ MVL: W by 14
Sydney @ AO: W by 112
Geelong @ AO: L by 84
Hawthorn @ AO: W by 3

 

[240volt]

Move on, he will coach out his contract for next year.

I find it unbelievable that normal thinking people can’t see this.
Anyway keep dreaming.

 

[Chrizzt]

Port's record against teams in the top 8 this year is 6-4. For context, Sydney's is 7-3, Brisbane's is 5-5 and Geelong's is 6-5. So based on this season at least I can't agree with the idea that Port capitulate against the top teams relative to their competitors. In previous years (especially around 2017) they absolutely could not beat teams in the top 8, but that imo hasn't been a problem for quite some years.

I would also challenge you to take the best 10 players out of any team and see how the remainder of the team performs against good sides. You're drawing some pretty long bows there which are purely subjective.

Hawthorn had the #1 offence and #1 defence since round 9 of this season. Won 15 of their past 19 games heading into last Friday night by an average of 45 points. They are a really good team and one can't simply overlook them and be dismissive of the win.

If Port win on Friday night, Ken deserves a lot of credit. Can't say that getting a team to a grand final is purely because of sound list management.

From 2020-2022 we were 10W-16L against top 8 sides, and 2W-10L against top 4 sides.
From 2023-2024 we are 10W-6L against top 8, and 4W-3L against top 4 sides.

However - we played the least games against top 8 sides this year, and played the equal least against top 8 sides last year. Given we only have a percentage of just under 100 in 2023 and just over 100 in 2024 against top 8 sides, it's fair to say that increasing the sample size likely would most likely increase the number of losses.

 

[PowerLil]

Don't conflate the two ideas.

1) Hinkley deserves credit if they make it to a grand final

By his own admission he's just the figurehead, or was that just to deflect taking ownership of the team's performance in the QF?
Don't worry. I know the answer.

 

[PowerBaz]

Can he be coach next year with an expiring contract?

 

[longdonkey]

Port's record against teams in the top 8 this year is 6-4. For context, Sydney's is 7-3, Brisbane's is 5-5 and Geelong's is 6-5. So based on this season at least I can't agree with the idea that Port capitulate against the top teams relative to their competitors. In previous years (especially around 2017) they absolutely could not beat teams in the top 8, but that imo hasn't been a problem for quite some years.

I would also challenge you to take the best 10 players out of any team and see how the remainder of the team performs against good sides. You're drawing some pretty long bows there which are purely subjective.

Hawthorn had the #1 offence and #1 defence since round 9 of this season. Won 15 of their past 19 games heading into last Friday night by an average of 45 points. They are a really good team and one can't simply overlook them and be dismissive of the win.

If Port win on Friday night, Ken deserves a lot of credit. Can't say that getting a team to a grand final is purely because of sound list management.

So there is a clear trend that the amount of time Hinkley spends in the coaches box is inversely proportional to the amount of wins we get against Top 8 and Top 4 opposition.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

Can he be coach next year with an expiring contract?

This is the problem. Bucks was talking about it the other day.

The AFL has created a narrative that coaches can't possibly coach out a contract year and Koch has created a narrative where we can't sack a coach with a contract. So round and round we go.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Portology]

Don't conflate the two ideas.

1) Hinkley deserves credit if anyone can point to any actual things he did to get the list to a grand final
2) the Club cannot do better while Hinkley is senior coach.

Both statements can be true.

FTFY

Perhaps. I still think we are relying too much on fanatical chaos and would be far better if the effort was coupled with better structure. We will never get that with Hinkley.

Geelong @ KP: W by 6
Hawthorn @ AO: W by 1
Carlton @ AO: L by 36
GWS @ SHO: L by 22
Brisbane @ AO: L by 79
Bulldogs @ AO: W by 48
Carlton @ MVL: W by 14
Sydney @ AO: W by 112
Geelong @ AO: L by 84
Hawthorn @ AO: W by 3

Yeah that's telling. For lack of better math-y terms it's the amplitude and shape of our yo-yo swings, mostly large-L and small-W, that makes it hard to believe we can win 3 finals in a row playing as we do against the 'more consistent' 'good' sides. And we're never getting a WB-2016 type umpired ride to the top.

Fanatical chaos is mostly on the players by definition. Last Friday night they owned a previous week's structural and setup failures in a way our coach never does. That first half was epic on effort, not so much on scoreboard pressure. And we just got over the line against a very well performing side who, yes, got a bit of a ride at key times (never mind the FK count, feel the quality of them) but also blew a real chance to win from behind in spite of everything. Winning 3 in a row at that intensity, dealing with 'bad run of cards' umpiring and serious outs from/weaknesses in the best 22 surely needs more than adrenaline and a 'rolling the dice' game plan FFS. If it turns out differently, happy to take that massive outlier for the record books but it won't change my opinion of Hinkley's limitations or of his limited contribution to it after a long decade of, ah, him "hitting his ceiling" to put it politely.

 

[Young Gun #6]

Heard Rozee on sen. They asked what you did this week to win and he just said we simplified everything.

He said basically Geelong game too many things to think about and not really clear messages so we simplified it all to just effort and contest work this week.

Sounds like the coaches have no ****ing clue don’t even send them out there with clear game plan so got absolutely walked off the park by Geelong.

Was confirming what we already think without probably meaning to say it. The coaching is shit house.

 

[sobrave]

I think due to my cosmic karma balance always resulting in suffering, the most likely outcome is:

• a 5-6 goal defeat against Sydney where we're never really in it, but we're close enough that it isn't completely embarrassing
• a heavy dose of media saying finals are hard to win, and making a prelim is a great outcome, and 14 other teams would be jealous
• this being more than enough for kockhead and co to declare season 2024 a ripping success, and we roll around in 2025 with good ol master coach Kenny at the helm.

 

[Kenny_Powers]

This is the problem. Bucks was talking about it the other day.

The AFL has created a narrative that coaches can't possibly coach out a contract year and Koch has created a narrative where we can't sack a coach with a contract. So round and round we go.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

I'm begrudgingly accepting of the fact that he will very likely be coaching next year....but how does this purported hand over work? The club will have to address the situation at some stage, either he's coaching for another contract extension next year, or he's seeing out his final year and will hand over to Carr.

If he fails to make a GF this year, I simply fail to see how he can coach for another contract next year given his length of tenure, failures, Josh waiting in the wings and supporter unrest.

But then this is Ken & Koch, anything is possible.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[Us against the rest]

Sam Edmund

@Sammy__Edmund
·
Follow
The West Coast coaching search has been narrowed to four candidates.Andrew McQualter

Andrew Mcqualter

Age

38

Ht

179cm

Wt

74kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.9

3star

K

5.6

2star

HB

7.2

4star

M

3.4

3star

T

3.6

5star

G

0.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

13.6

4star

K

7.6

3star

HB

6.0

4star

M

3.0

3star

T

2.4

4star

G

0.2

3star

, Steven King

Steven King

Age

45

Ht

201cm

Wt

104kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

12.8

3star

K

7.9

3star

HB

4.9

4star

CL

1.3

3star

HO

16.8

5star

No current season stats available

D

11.8

3star

K

6.4

3star

HB

5.4

4star

HO

8.8

5star

, Brett Montgomery

Brett Montgomery

Age

51

Ht

180cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

D/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

15.3

4star

K

8.9

3star

HB

6.4

4star

M

5.8

5star

T

1.4

3star

No current season stats available

D

11.6

3star

K

8.8

4star

HB

2.8

3star

M

4.6

5star

T

1.2

3star

and Hayden Skipworth

Hayden Skipworth

Age

41

Ht

177cm

Wt

78kg

Pos.

M/F

Career

Season

Last 5

D

14.3

4star

K

7.8

3star

HB

6.5

4star

M

3.8

4star

T

2.4

4star

No current season stats available

D

8.0

2star

K

5.8

3star

HB

2.2

2star

M

1.8

2star

T

2.4

4star

are the quartet of contenders left in the race for the Eagles’ top job. King and McQualter seen as the frontrunners of that four.

It’s understood Port Adelaide coach Ken Hinkley was never approached and regardless, has never had any desire to move to Perth.

Just give up, our club is run by a load of selfish egotistical arse wipes.

 

[Enviable Tradition]

I'm begrudgingly accepting of the fact that he will very likely be coaching next year....but how does this purported hand over work? The club will have to address the situation at some stage, either he's coaching for another contract extension next year, or he's seeing out his final year and will hand over to Carr.

If he fails to make a GF this year, I simply fail to see how he can coach for another contract next year given his length of tenure, failures, Josh waiting in the wings and supporter unrest.

But then this is Ken & Koch, anything is possible.


On iPhone using BigFooty.com mobile app

I'm getting to the stage where I wouldn't be surprised if they give him another 1 year extension because he couldn't possibly coach out the final year of his contract, the pressure wouldn't be fair.

On SM-G975F using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[longdonkey]

Sam Edmund

@Sammy__Edmund
·
Follow
The West Coast coaching search has been narrowed to four candidates.Andrew McQualter, Steven King, Brett Montgomery and Hayden Skipworth are the quartet of contenders left in the race for the Eagles’ top job. King and McQualter seen as the frontrunners of that four.

It’s understood Port Adelaide coach Ken Hinkley was never approached and regardless, has never had any desire to move to Perth.

Just give up, our club is run by a load of selfish egotistical arse wipes.

As I said some way back I heard King was pretty much a dead certainty and Hinkley not approached.