Certified Legendary Thread Sack Hinkley 12 - Finals Are Scary

[PowerLil]

Everyone loves Kenny sooo much. Blah blah blah so much blah blah blah. How on earth will we survive?

 

[b0ydman Jr]

I'm lead to believe that West Coast are and have never been interested in Hinkley.

interesting, i've heard quite the opposite from a reliable source

 

[Contested Marx]

No sign of a moving truck this morning when I took the pooch for a wander past his place.

PM address please

I don't have a dog but just finished my third black coffee and a bran muffin with dates

 

[theouthouse]

The biggest issue that should be driving the change of coach is the gameplan. It is so obvious to all of us, obvious to all in the media, obvious to all external fans, however clearly not obvious to the coach. We just keep doing the same thing year in year out. We play this utterly ridiculous high press, trying to lock the ball in forward 50. We are instructed to bomb it forward and lock it in. We have done it for so many years now and nothing changes.

There is endless evidence now to prove that this gameplan does not work against the best teams and even more so, does not work at all in high intensity pressure finals against the best teams. The top teams just cut straight through it and create constant over the top goals. It also puts enormous pressure on our players in the big games, where one missed kick results in an easy counter attack goal. As seen again in the Sydney game on Friday night, they had some record score from turnover, which purely was from our horrendous gameplan.

It works fine against the lower teams, as they don't have the skills to counter it, however why create an entire gameplan based around beating the lower teams? For this to work against the good teams, we need to play absolutely perfect, with no margin for error. Rarely will this happen, again so much proof and evidence.

This issue is on the coach and nothing else. It was not anything new this year, as it has been the same plan for years and years now. Any half decent coach just congests the corridor and the defensive 50 and then play counter attack. How we have not changed this in the previous 5 years is disgusting.

I just wish we could play a normal structure and gameplan like everyone else. Stop trying to be cute and think you are a mastermind Hinkley, because you most certainly are not.

Just a quick run through on the statistics on the weekend. Port had less turnovers than both Brisbane and Geelong in their respective game. And from memory Brisbane had more turnovers yet still managed a win.

Sydney still only had 10 or so less than Port did.

In finals and high pressure games there are always going to be turnovers and that comes back to gameplan and structure in how to minimise the scoreboard damage and win the ball back. Knowing when to go offensively while making sure defensively the ground and opposition is covered.

 

[1954]

Take a step back, and ask yourself hypothetically, even if they had decided to move him on, there are some serious logistics they need to sort out with respect to football department expenditure which is related to any potential payout.

Unfortunately this requires a bit of nuance, and isn't as easy as making a phone call to Peter Blucher and Ken informing them of the Club's decision.



There are some players who genuinely love him. There are also a group who don't think much of him, and another group are indifferent. It is much the same with every coach. I don't think it's a specific directive by the Club's PR/media team though. But when your coach is under so much pressure, the players are going to be asked ad nauseam how they feel about Ken. It's all media spin to generate clicks.

Take Chris Fagan for instance. The players absolutely love him, but above all else, they respect him as a coach and as a man. They're certainly not going to the local RSL after gameday for a few bevies and a bet on the dogs that's for sure.



Thanks, but the only coffee I do is in ice cream, cake (ie tiramisu) or espresso martinis



With the way some people carry on in the forum I would have thought they would be willing to do such a job for free.



Deadlines spur actions. Free agency starts next Friday, October 6. So things will have to be wrapped up by then. That is also the night of the Club's B&F which, if there is an amicable parting of ways, would be a good way to send Ken off (I'm merely thinking about the optics here).

At the same time, I suspect if the Club make the decision this week, they could hold off on making the news public and simply notify the prospective players they're interested in (like Perryman) that there will be some news being made public after the grand final of noteworthy substance.



They don't need West Coast to get rid of him.

Your `tiramisu or espresso martini' comment has me wondering if you are George Fiacchi.

 

[Forumposter]

Made an account just to finally contribute to this thread. Been a club member since 1997 sans a few years here and there.



This situation is bizarre and is just another example of people in positions of power who have no idea what they’re doing. It’s not as if there will ever be a statue built outside AO of the current coach, and yet most of the media plus a lot of the club (seemingly) act as if this is the case. (And has been pointed out many times, both the media and even folks at the club might not have the club’s best interests at heart). But as we know, this is the longest serving coach never to make a grand final in the history of the game. Once again we have failed to move past the preliminary. Even if the list were not up to scratch - which it basically is (please note all the players who have won premierships who aren’t superstars) - the coach has had 12 years to compile a list which could, at the very least, make a grand final. Meanwhile, insert all the clubs that have made a GF or won one in that time (off the top of my head the ones who haven’t made a GF are Carlton, Essendon, Saints, GC, and North). And the so-called incredible H&A win-loss record is bolstered significantly with winning most games against those clubs (North, GC, etc.), while we have repeatedly failed to win games against good teams.



But the thing I want to emphasise is that the language, the ideas, and the attitude in general, which have been at play during this period of time, have not been helpful in actually winning a premiership. From “finals are scary” to using Oppenheimer as a theme (etcetera), the players have not been given a psychological chance of winning. I think they are emotionally psyched out because of the high amount of stress in the atmosphere, which I know others have spoken about but I just want to emphasise this point. Compare driving a car when you are totally stressed with being calm and relaxed. Yes sometimes playing with such stress can work in a game of footy, but the intensity is not sustainable and generally lacks joy. You need to actually want to win. We fell over the line in the one stress-induced finals win we’ve had in ten years. Premiership teams often want to play tough finals football. They manage to transform the stress into excitement (the language around Sydney last week was all about being excited). They were excited, we were unable to focus. 9.1 to 4.6. Under this coach, getting closer and closer to success has brought about more and more stress. And there’s been little guidance on what to do with this, because I don’t think the coach knows. And I think that deep down the players have wanted to avoid more of the psychological hellscape that comes about as we near success, and so it’s basic self-sabotage. It’s missing goals and kicking perfectly to the opposition when an opportunity is actually there. But the key here is that it doesn’t have to be so hellish. The players can learn how to relate differently to the emotions that come up, hopefully with a different coach who has been successful in winning a premiership. They need some breathing air, a fresh approach with a different attitude. The whole club needs it. Let’s give ourselves the best chance of winning some flags.

 

[sobrave]

Not sure the AFL want much happening GF week. Hopefully it’s all sorted this week then ‘bang’ in Monday or Tuesday, cuddles all around at the presser.

Who cares what the AFL want, sack him now

 

[philreich]

People who have spoken to Carr directly know the way Port would play under him would be vastly different to the way they currently play.

Which is precisely why I think we should give Carr a chance to prove himself as coach, before writing him off. Josh will do things his way, but he can't do much until we get rid of Hinkley.

 

[SureBuddy]

Just a quick run through on the statistics on the weekend. Port had less turnovers than both Brisbane and Geelong in their respective game. And from memory Brisbane had more turnovers yet still managed a win.

Sydney still only had 10 or so less than Port did.

In finals and high pressure games there are always going to be turnovers and that comes back to gameplan and structure in how to minimise the scoreboard damage and win the ball back. Knowing when to go offensively while making sure defensively the ground and opposition is covered.

Yup exactly.

Swans scored 95 points. Of which, 76 points were scored from turnovers. That is an absurd amount.

 

[Alberton Proud]

I have been keeping a magnificent can of Diet Coke for a special occasion. If the Club and Ken part ways the ring pull is coming off!

I've got this bad boy on ice

 

[Eddie Woloschek]

If they are bringing in a first time coach they will also find a very experienced senior assistant. The soft cap doesn’t really apply to West Coast.

Ken would actually be good in that sort of a role. The media love him which would take so much pressure off a new coach.

Ken would not be good in any football role and West Coast know that. He was never prime rib and he's now well and truly overcooked. The media's love for him might actually be a negative for any young coach that the bogan is 'helping'.

 

[StrappingTape]

Which is precisely why I think we should give Carr a chance to prove himself as coach, before writing him off. Josh will do things his way, but he can't do much until we get rid of Hinkley.

We should go to market and see who the best available is, not promote within without looking again. I'd rather a completely fresh new voice.

 

[Marmozet]

Just imagine how much more positivity there’ll be when he’s finally gone, even if it is just Josh Carr

Josh Carr

Age

44

Ht

179cm

Wt

80kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.8

4star

K

10.6

4star

HB

7.2

4star

M

4.0

4star

T

3.3

5star

CL

2.0

4star

No current season stats available

D

12.2

3star

K

7.2

3star

HB

5.0

4star

M

2.6

3star

T

0.8

3star

being promoted.

I’d actually enjoy winning again and I’d have so much more optimism that things will be different in September.

 

[philreich]

Rozee interviewed at the airport today.

"The players love Kenny"

Vomit worthy.

I call BS - Connor would privately be spewing that he'll be watching yet another grand final on TV this Saturday, instead of being part of the action. I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall in the dressing room after the game: if I was a betting man, the words "I love Kenny " wouldn't have passed the lips of many of the players.

 

[philreich]

We should go to market and see who the best available is, not promote within without looking again. I'd rather a completely fresh new voice.

I don't disagree, but doing nothing is worse than appointing Carr.

 

[StrappingTape]

I don't disagree, but doing nothing is worse than appointing Carr.

Yeah if the choice is nothing or this then definitely this.

 

[Eddie Woloschek]

Made an account just to finally contribute to this thread. Been a club member since 1997 sans a few years here and there.



This situation is bizarre and is just another example of people in positions of power who have no idea what they’re doing. It’s not as if there will ever be a statue built outside AO of the current coach, and yet most of the media plus a lot of the club (seemingly) act as if this is the case. (And has been pointed out many times, both the media and even folks at the club might not have the club’s best interests at heart). But as we know, this is the longest serving coach never to make a grand final in the history of the game. Once again we have failed to move past the preliminary. Even if the list were not up to scratch - which it basically is (please note all the players who have won premierships who aren’t superstars) - the coach has had 12 years to compile a list which could, at the very least, make a grand final. Meanwhile, insert all the clubs that have made a GF or won one in that time (off the top of my head the ones who haven’t made a GF are Carlton, Essendon, Saints, GC, and North). And the so-called incredible H&A win-loss record is bolstered significantly with winning most games against those clubs (North, GC, etc.), while we have repeatedly failed to win games against good teams.



But the thing I want to emphasise is that the language, the ideas, and the attitude in general, which have been at play during this period of time, have not been helpful in actually winning a premiership. From “finals are scary” to using Oppenheimer as a theme (etcetera), the players have not been given a psychological chance of winning. I think they are emotionally psyched out because of the high amount of stress in the atmosphere, which I know others have spoken about but I just want to emphasise this point. Compare driving a car when you are totally stressed with being calm and relaxed. Yes sometimes playing with such stress can work in a game of footy, but the intensity is not sustainable and generally lacks joy. You need to actually want to win. We fell over the line in the one stress-induced finals win we’ve had in ten years. Premiership teams often want to play tough finals football. They manage to transform the stress into excitement (the language around Sydney last week was all about being excited). They were excited, we were unable to focus. 9.1 to 4.6. Under this coach, getting closer and closer to success has brought about more and more stress. And there’s been little guidance on what to do with this, because I don’t think the coach knows. And I think that deep down the players have wanted to avoid more of the psychological hellscape that comes about as we near success, and so it’s basic self-sabotage. It’s missing goals and kicking perfectly to the opposition when an opportunity is actually there. But the key here is that it doesn’t have to be so hellish. The players can learn how to relate differently to the emotions that come up, hopefully with a different coach who has been successful in winning a premiership. They need some breathing air, a fresh approach with a different attitude. The whole club needs it. Let’s give ourselves the best chance of winning some flags.

That sounds to me like garden variety Munchausen's by Proxy*: "You just can't survive without Daddy Donuts." "Daddy Donuts will make you better." The question is, who is practising this? Club or coach?

 

[philreich]

What would you like him to say?

Maybe apologise to the supporters for once?

 

[ClintEastwood]

View attachment miocreate_faceswap.mp4

 

[KrispyKremeMullanikka]

View attachment 2119127

 

[El_Scorcho]

Take a step back, and ask yourself hypothetically, even if they had decided to move him on, there are some serious logistics they need to sort out with respect to football department expenditure which is related to any potential payout.

Unfortunately this requires a bit of nuance, and isn't as easy as making a phone call to Peter Blucher and Ken informing them of the Club's decision.

The club should have been making preparations for this after the Geelong game.

If we haven't heard anything by say, Wednesday, you'd have to assume it's not happening.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

Yeah if the choice is nothing or this then definitely this.

If the choice is nothing or Mark Neeld then Neeld me up baby

 

[Sewer de Lance]

I call BS - Connor would privately be spewing that he'll be watching yet another grand final on TV this Saturday, instead of being part of the action. I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall in the dressing room after the game: if I was a betting man, the words "I love Kenny " wouldn't have passed the lips of many of the players.

You’re way off point on Connor. The part time jewellery designer said he hardly watches any football during his free time. Him & his misses will probably go shoe shopping when the grannies on.

 

[EskimoPAFC]

Also anyone who is telling you how bad it will be for you without them is NEVER someone you should have in your life.

 

[PowerBaz]

The club should have been making preparations for this after the Geelong game.

If we haven't heard anything by say, Wednesday, you'd have to assume it's not happening.

I reckon it might get sorted this week but the AFL would really want the focus on the GF and lead up to it, Brownlow, parade etc.....

Maybe Friday? if it's a thing it will be Monday/Tuesday for sure next week.

The fact there has already been a 'walk away story' from Morris maybe makes me think something is up.

Fingers crossed eh.