List Mgmt. Trade & Free Agency talk Pt 7

[Lore]

Hello Tiger fans!

The embedded resources below are kept up to date by the trade board mods (as much as possible – we are human after all). Enjoy!

Spoiler: 2023 Draft Order

Spoiler: 2024 Draft Order, aka Future Picks

Spoiler: Blue Tick Rumours

tugga you may like to sticky or merge this post, move it to the start of the thread (so the sticky post doesn't rotate if a post is deleted before it), or copy it to your draft thread.

 

[tigerfan1961]

They are threatened by Clarko.

Nope, they are on the money. What they’ve given Norf is a disgrace. They get compensated for finishing second last by having pick 2.
Takes a few years for high draft picks to impact a clubs performance and they’ve had them for 2-4 years now. They’ll improve even without these ridiculous handouts. I’m absolutely livid with the AFL for this decision

 

[tigerfan1961]

Season 23 in the absence of Lynch it was Jack R Andrew a cast of thousands rotating up fwd.

The midfield of tarranto, hopper, Cotch, Prestia, Graham, Bolton, Dusty and Dow later, didn't work.

And despite how poorly the season went we were too close to making the 8 that Mini could not play the kids. Or drop senior players.
Yze has no loyalty to any player so I hope we clean the slate. We have a number of players who missed the whole season, so we don't need a lot of picks in this draft. Any FA KPF is required. I'd have liked Riccardi but Kosi fine.. Lynch is a watch, but Dusty money freed up end of 24.

Coulthard, Cumberland, Bauer, Ryan can play. As can Sonsie, Clarke, Banks, tresise. As can Young, Brown , gibcus.

Throw in a Game plan change Will be interesting to see.
24 might be a good season with a new coach
Play the best available and if flag players are in the VFL then fine. Let's boost that team too.
Sun's VFL team was full of AFL players.
RFC haven't matched bids on players wanting to leave. Jeez. Baker. He's captain material..
From WA. Eagles want him? They are managing a transition. Bringing in low cost depth players. Post Tim Kelly anyway, in the rebuild phase..

Spot on, I just don’t get all the doom and gloom on here about next year. I reckon we will bounce back up pretty hard as we still have a great nucleus of good players imo.

 

[Lsta062]

Probably an unpopular opinion outside of North Melbourne, but I think the assistance package they received makes sense. I’d probably have said to give them pick 3 this year instead of the three late first-round picks. It would’ve helped more.

My reasoning is that the whole purpose of the draft is to equalise the competition. Therefore, why wouldn’t it be used to boost an awful side?

Well, the draft is more equal opportunity commensurate with finishing position, but sometimes a side comes that’s really struggling for talent. After being bottom 2 since 2020, North have reached that level.

Yeah quite a bit has to do with bad list management, but North Melbourne also didn’t really get access to some talent due to the draft being somewhat compromised. JUH was unavailable, Ashcroft was unavailable, Nick Daicos was unavailable, and Sam Darcy was unavailable. Now they finished second-last, Jed Walter is not available either. May have gone straight after Harley Reid in an open draft.

So I actually don’t mind what the AFL did. Yeah they managed their list badly, but this is the first time North Melbourne have been in this position since I started watching footy. Sometimes shit happens.

Hawthorn, Carlton, Richmond, and Collingwood received assistance in the 2000s when they weren’t good either. We were a basket case but some of those clubs were probably better than North is now. And they still received assistance.

 

[Coach_Required]

Probably an unpopular opinion outside of North Melbourne, but I think the assistance package they received makes sense. I’d probably have said to give them pick 3 this year instead of the three late first-round picks. It would’ve helped more.

My reasoning is that the whole purpose of the draft is to equalise the competition. Therefore, why wouldn’t it be used to boost an awful side?

Well, the draft is more equal opportunity commensurate with finishing position, but sometimes a side comes that’s really struggling for talent. After being bottom 2 since 2020, North have reached that level.

Yeah quite a bit has to do with bad list management, but North Melbourne also didn’t really get access to some talent due to the draft being somewhat compromised. JUH was unavailable, Ashcroft was unavailable, Nick Daicos was unavailable, and Sam Darcy was unavailable. Now they finished second-last, Jed Walter is not available either. May have gone straight after Harley Reid in an open draft.

So I actually don’t mind what the AFL did. Yeah they managed their list badly, but this is the first time North Melbourne have been in this position since I started watching footy. Sometimes s**t happens.

Hawthorn, Carlton, Richmond, and Collingwood received assistance in the 2000s when they weren’t good either. We were a basket case but some of those clubs were probably better than North is now. And they still received assistance.

You need to read between the AFL lines though. They will now have pick 14 & 19 which they could trade to Gold Coast for pick 4. If they get pick 3 for losing Ben McKay then they will have picks 2,3 & 4. That's massively overs.

 

[tiger_tough]

I'm not convinced he'd even get a game.

Would need to have the defensive side of the game heavily coached into him, which isn't often successful. A bit like Cumbo really — they have similar issues.

Yeah he'd need to play alongside a tackling/pressuring small forward like Hill at the Pies, Pickett at the Dees etc. If Yze can get Cumberland firing that'd be ideal.

 

[Muddiemoose]

You need to read between the AFL lines though. They will now have pick 14 & 19 which they could trade to Gold Coast for pick 4. If they get pick 3 for losing Ben McKay then they will have picks 2,3 & 4. That's massively overs.

Can’t really group them all up together because they are all from separate mechanisms and unrelated to each other
The only real handout they are getting are 14 & 19 and if they trade them that’s completely up to them

We got our fair share of compo picks when our club was in a similar position so it’s a little rich for us to cry foul now

 

[Coach_Required]

Can’t really group them all up together because they are all from separate mechanisms and unrelated to each other
The only real handout they are getting are 14 & 19 and if they trade them that’s completely up to them

We got our fair share of compo picks when our club was in a similar position so it’s a little rich for us to cry foul now

The AFL knew exactly what they were doing when they gave the concessions they did.
Don't be fooled by this corrupt organization.

 

[Muddiemoose]

The AFL knew exactly what they were doing when they gave the concessions they did.
Don't be fooled by this corrupt organization.

So you think we shouldn’t of been given pick 1 for lids and pick 19 for Rance?

Like I said it’s a little rich that we have a problem with the system when we took advantage for the same system when we were shit

Or for whatever reason we enter a period of multiple bottom 4 finishes you will be upset about the afl giving us a handout if we ask for it?

 

[Coach_Required]

So you think we shouldn’t of been given pick 1 for lids and pick 19 for Rance?

Like I said it’s a little rich that we have a problem with the system when we took advantage for the same system when we were s**t

Or for whatever reason we enter a period of multiple bottom 4 finishes you will be upset about the afl giving us a handout if we ask for it?

I have an issue with how the AFL don't have a set formula for it and can just make it up, I have an issue that the AFL gave some assistance already to North last year, I have an issue the AFL have manipulated this years draft to give them possibly maximum assistance and I have an issue that the AFL have even said they may even get more 1st round picks next year.
What a joke

 

[Downtown06]

So you think we shouldn’t of been given pick 1 for lids and pick 19 for Rance?

Like I said it’s a little rich that we have a problem with the system when we took advantage for the same system when we were s**t

Or for whatever reason we enter a period of multiple bottom 4 finishes you will be upset about the afl giving us a handout if we ask for it?

We did finish last that year to get pick 1 though.

What about in 2007, we finished last but got pick 2 (Cotchin which played out very well) but the AFL had that stupid system where if you win the wooden spoon the year before and then win less then 4.5 games you are rewarded pick 1

 

[poppa pump]

From a Pies perspective, considering he is contracted, you'd need to be giving up a late first or early second. He's a young player, has shown he's up to the level and is in our best 23 (Fly sees it as a 23, not a 22).

So not picked in half of Collingwood games played and as sub for another 7,
Pick in the 40s ,so 3rd in 24.

 

[panatha1908]

Afl is too involved. They argue that compensation needed as north didn't have access to all the best kids, like the gc academy player this year. Why do 4 clubs get any academy players they want and the rest don't? We talk sydney coming up but effectively they can finish anywhere on the ladder and take the best nsw talent (e.g.gulden) wherever their name is called. That's insane, the draft order now has no bearing on the players taken by 4 teams (Brisbane, gold coast, Sydney and GWS) and then they'll say what great list management. That's a manipulation every single year. How would we go getting these blokes with whatever our next pick was..

SWANS ACADEMY NOTABLE PLAYERS
Isaac Heeney
Callum Mills

14

Callum Mills

Age

27

Ht

188cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

18.2

5star

K

10.8

4star

HB

7.4

5star

M

5.3

5star

T

2.6

4star

CL

0.6

3star

D

18.4

4star

K

11.5

4star

HB

6.9

4star

M

5.4

5star

T

3.4

4star

CL

1.4

4star

D

17.0

5star

K

9.4

4star

HB

7.6

5star

M

4.4

4star

T

2.8

5star

CL

1.2

4star

Nick Blakey

22

Nick Blakey

Age

24

Ht

196cm

Wt

83kg

Pos.

Def

Career

Season

Last 5

D

9.9

3star

K

7.0

3star

HB

2.9

3star

M

2.3

2star

T

2.4

4star

MG

189.1

3star

D

8.1

2star

K

6.3

3star

HB

1.9

1star

M

2.1

2star

T

2.6

4star

MG

189.1

3star

D

7.2

2star

K

5.2

2star

HB

2.0

2star

M

1.2

2star

T

1.2

3star

Sam Naismith

24

Sam Naismith

Age

32

Ht

205cm

Wt

108kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

8.9

2star

K

3.6

1star

HB

5.3

4star

CL

2.0

4star

HO

25.5

5star

D

9.5

2star

K

7.5

3star

HB

2.0

1star

CL

3.0

4star

HO

26.5

5star

D

9.2

3star

K

3.2

2star

HB

6.0

4star

CL

1.4

4star

HO

25.4

5star

Sam Wicks
Braeden Campbell
Errol Gulden

 

[panatha1908]

We did finish last that year to get pick 1 though.

What about in 2007, we finished last but got pick 2 (Cotchin which played out very well) but the AFL had that stupid system where if you win the wooden spoon the year before and then win less then 4.5 games you are rewarded pick 1

The afl has an equalisation measure being the draft. Then if a player leaves as a free agent you get compensated. Every other draft manipulation i.e. extra picks, academy picks inside top 4p etc needs to end to allow a level playing field

 

[Downtown06]

The afl has an equalisation measure being the draft. Then if a player leaves as a free agent you get compensated. Every other draft manipulation i.e. extra picks, academy picks inside top 4p etc needs to end to allow a level playing field

Even that is iffy at the best of time. James Frawley when he left wasn't worth the pick 3 Mel got and then what did the Hawks get for losing Buddy? Pick 19? Even that needs a proper look at.

 

[Lsta062]

You need to read between the AFL lines though. They will now have pick 14 & 19 which they could trade to Gold Coast for pick 4. If they get pick 3 for losing Ben McKay then they will have picks 2,3 & 4. That's massively overs.

Meh I’m still fine with even that IMO. I’m not really too caught up with the assistance bottom teams get. Even if it’s overs, they may not nail all those picks anyway.

I’m actually more annoyed at top 4 quality teams getting someone like Ashcroft (probably pick 1) just because of genealogy. Or a top-8 side getting JUH. They don’t need the assistance.

Especially that father-son rule. Some teams build premiership sides just because their ex-players managed to have enough sons around the same time.

 

[Lsta062]

Can’t really group them all up together because they are all from separate mechanisms and unrelated to each other
The only real handout they are getting are 14 & 19 and if they trade them that’s completely up to them

We got our fair share of compo picks when our club was in a similar position so it’s a little rich for us to cry foul now

See that’s my point. The big VIC clubs got assistance in the 2000s for bad list management. Carlton and Richmond in particular were big beneficiaries of opportunity like this. Melbourne were looked after recently by Frawley netting pick 3 compensation.

Meanwhile, North were actually one of the decently run clubs that would only finish bottom 4 sporadically. This is really the only times since at least the 70s they’ve been a proper basket case for an extended period of time. That’s gotta count for something at least.

 

[Muddiemoose]

We did finish last that year to get pick 1 though.

What about in 2007, we finished last but got pick 2 (Cotchin which played out very well) but the AFL had that stupid system where if you win the wooden spoon the year before and then win less then 4.5 games you are rewarded pick 1

Wasn’t 2007 bookended by us finishing a little better the year before? Memory is fuzzy but it wasn’t consecutive bottom finishes and the team made some improvements

North have finished bottom two for what? The last 4 or 5 years straight all while multiple pick ones have been taken via other measures (Dogs with JUH & the pies with Diacos)
If that’s a club that isn’t in need of some assistance I’m not sure what is

 

[guruisatiger]

An

You need to read between the AFL lines though. They will now have pick 14 & 19 which they could trade to Gold Coast for pick 4. If they get pick 3 for losing Ben McKay then they will have picks 2,3 & 4. That's massively overs.

D they'll still **** it up even with picks 2 ,3 and 4

 

[guruisatiger]

We got 2

Can’t really group them all up together because they are all from separate mechanisms and unrelated to each other
The only real handout they are getting are 14 & 19 and if they trade them that’s completely up to them

We got our fair share of compo picks when our club was in a similar position so it’s a little rich for us to cry foul now

We got 2 picks

 

[Downtown06]

Wasn’t 2007 bookended by us finishing a little better the year before? Memory is fuzzy but it wasn’t consecutive bottom finishes and the team made some improvements

North have finished bottom two for what? The last 4 or 5 years straight all while multiple pick ones have been taken via other measures (Dogs with JUH & the pies with Diacos)
If that’s a club that isn’t in need of some assistance I’m not sure what is

Yeah 2006 we finished 9th but Carlton finished last and got pick 1.

the year later they finished second last but still got pick 1 under the new compensation rule of winning less then 4.5 games IIRC.

 

[bd3_]

Wow the afl is corrupt … who would’ve thought?

Why didn’t Ross and Scott speak up when they created a stand rule to stop our game style?? More puppets under the system.

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Wasn’t 2007 bookended by us finishing a little better the year before? Memory is fuzzy but it wasn’t consecutive bottom finishes and the team made some improvements

North have finished bottom two for what? The last 4 or 5 years straight all while multiple pick ones have been taken via other measures (Dogs with JUH & the pies with Diacos)
If that’s a club that isn’t in need of some assistance I’m not sure what is

They do need something. I definitely favour the assistance picks being after the first round. Those picks in the 20's can be swapped for competitive prime aged players, which seems to be what they need most, and they should have the coin to entice them with some overs as well. There will be some clubs who can afford to lose this range of player as they will have youngsters coming up who are as good or better and looking for opportunities. Remembering North have already had help last year when they got 3 2023 priority picks used to trade for Logue and Tucker, that currently sit at 22, 41 and 59 and were already compromising this draft.

So overall they get on top of their natural high end rd 1, rd 2, and rd 3 picks(let's say in 2023 picks 3, 25, 40):

2023 draft - picks currently sitting at 21, 22, 41, 59(the earlier ones will slide substantially to high 20's picks)

2024 draft - provisionally given picks 19, 20(which will presumably slide a bit) to be reviewed after 2024 season.

So the idea I don't mind but the magnitude of the assistance seems overkill. 1 pick in the 20's and one in the 40's in each of 2 drafts would have been enough to secure 4 competitive mature players. Now North are left in a position where if they are competitive in 2024 they cost themselves 2 picks in the low 20's, but if they are uncompetitive they get the picks. Talk about incentive to tank. 4 picks in the 20's + an early 3rd and 4th round pick gets you half of most club's quotas or prime aged competitive mature players.

If they can't compete after that, they need to be placed under administration.

 

[Muddiemoose]

They do need something. I definitely favour the assistance picks being after the first round. Thos picks in the 20's can be swapped for competitive prime aged players, which seems to be what they need most, and they should have the coin to entice them with some overs as well. There will be some clubs who can afford to lose this range of player as they will have youngsters coming up who are as good or better and looking for opportunities. Remembering North have already had help last year when they got 3 2023 priority picks used to trade for Logue and Tucker, that currently sit at 22, 41 and 59 and were already compromising this draft.

So overall they get on top of their natural high end rd 1, rd 2, and rd 3 picks(let's say in 2023 picks 3, 25, 40):

2023 draft - picks currently sitting at 21, 22, 41, 59(the earlier ones will slide substantially to high 20's picks)

2024 draft - provisionally given picks 19, 20(which will presumably slide a bit) to be reviewed after 2024 season.

So the idea I don't mind but the magnitude of the assistance seems overkill. 1 pick in the 20's and one in the 40's in each of 2 drafts would have been enough to secure 4 competitive mature players. Now North are left in a position where if they are competitive in 2024 they cost themselves 2 picks in the low 20's, but if they are uncompetitive they get the picks. Talk about incentive to tank. 4 picks in the 20's + an early 3rd and 4th round pick gets you half of most club's quotas or prime aged competitive mature players.

If they can't compete after that, they need to be placed under administration.

Agree with everything you are saying, only thing free the two picks for next year is that I dare say north will trade them (or at least they should) and it takes it out of the AFL’s hands in regards to taking the pick off them if they are more competitive on field

 

[Meteoric Rise]

Agree with everything you are saying, only thing free the two picks for next year is that I dare say north will trade them (or at least they should) and it takes it out of the AFL’s hands in regards to taking the pick off them if they are more competitive on field

I am not sure they will be allowed to do that as they may not have actually been given the picks yet.

 

[Tigerbob]

The rumours of Melbourne pulling out something big this trade period is growing large.

There has been constant whispers of Tom Lynch but I don’t believe that.

What else could they be up to and more importantly, I hope Yze knows and can work on capatilising any big moves they make for the benefit of our footy club.