List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[DJ75]

Does anyone here actually think that we are one or two experienced players away from making a deep finals run?
It seems like our leaders think so - it's the only explanation as to why we are (reportedly) looking at players like Yeo or Parker.

Personally I think that if any of our list management team truly believe that these are the players we need, then they need to be sacked on the spot. Utter delusion. All adding Parker or Yeo would do is keep us mid table and permanently halt any chance the rebuild had of being successful. Neither player would be there when our current squad peaks, and what they would do is completely halt any chance of developing a finals level midfield.

Are we really that delusional?

 

[Vader]

Does anyone here actually think that we are one or two experienced players away from making a deep finals run?
It seems like our leaders think so - it's the only explanation as to why we are (reportedly) looking at players like Yeo or Parker.

Personally I think that if any of our list management team truly believe that these are the players we need, then they need to be sacked on the spot. Utter delusion. All adding Parker or Yeo would do is keep us mid table and permanently halt any chance the rebuild had of being successful. Neither player would be there when our current squad peaks, and what they would do is completely halt any chance of developing a finals level midfield.

Are we really that delusional?

Our close results against the top teams over the last 2 years, where we've lost multiple games against top-8 teams by less than a goal, suggests that we're not too far off. However, the players are not currently performing anywhere near that level - and the players who carried the bulk of the burden during that period (e.g. Walker) are now rapidly approaching the end.

There are definitely issues which need to be addressed - not the least of which is the game plan which Nicks tried to implement at the start of the year.

With a decent game plan (like we had last year), and a decent run with injuries (we're currently missing Walker, Rankine, Crouch, Worrell, Thilthorpe, and Murray from our best 22), and we have the ability to go deep into the finals. Without those elements, as we are at present, we find ourselves in the bottom-4. We're not that far away - but at the moment it feels like we're light years off.

 

[DJ75]

Our close results against the top teams over the last 2 years, where we've lost multiple games against top-8 teams by less than a goal, suggests that we're not too far off. However, the players are not currently performing anywhere near that level - and the players who carried the bulk of the burden during that period (e.g. Walker) are now rapidly approaching the end.

There are definitely issues which need to be addressed - not the least of which is the game plan which Nicks tried to implement at the start of the year.

With a decent game plan (like we had last year), and a decent run with injuries (we're currently missing Walker, Rankine, Crouch, Worrell, Thilthorpe, and Murray from our best 22), and we have the ability to go deep into the finals. Without those elements, as we are at present, we find ourselves in the bottom-4. We're not that far away - but at the moment it feels like we're light years off.

Now take off the rose coloured glasses and have a good look at who we have actually beaten in the last 12 months...You know, even with our good plan and fit team. Check it.

We ARE light years away. Do you really think we can compete with Sydney when our fully fit midfield has Crouch and Laird in it? Those two won't be able to get within 100 m of Warner and Heeney once they take off.

 

[Captain Furious]

Haha, I got the big thumbs down from old mate Sanders when I suggested a while back Luke Parker was on the outer and might be worth a look?

Good sign you’re on the right path.

 

[Blue Red and Gold]

Would we look at Oliver again? Melbourne possibly looking at rejuvenating their list in light of recent results, we've got the cap space and could take on his contract.

 

[maxlilly]

I saw Dawson reposting one of Luke Parkers wifes business posts on social media over the weekend and thought that was a bit strange.

Parker is 32 in October. Wife looks to have a successful business in Sydney.

I read that as 'one of Luke Parkers wives'

 

[Vader]

Now take off the rose coloured glasses and have a good look at who we have actually beaten in the last 12 months...You know, even with our good plan and fit team. Check it.

Have a look at the list of teams we were a bee's dick away from beating last year - Melbourne, Collingwood, Sydney...

We ARE light years away. Do you really think we can compete with Sydney when our fully fit midfield has Crouch and Laird in it? Those two won't be able to get within 100 m of Warner and Heeney once they take off.

Sydney are a mile ahead of every other team in the competition this year. In 2024 we have beaten Carlton (currently 2nd), and Port (4th). We lost to Collingwood (6th), in Melbourne, by less than a goal. So yes, with a full playing deck and a competent game plan, I think we'd be very competitive against every team other than Sydney.

Unlike teams like Collingwood, we don't have the depth/experience to cover injuries to our key players. We lost Tex, Thilthorpe and Himmelberg, and our replacements are Burgess & Gollant (or shifting Borlase from defence). We lost Rankine, and had to replace him with McHenry. Murray is the only player for whom we have reasonable quality replacements, and even then Murray is still a huge upgrade on all of our current KPDs.

The fact is that we don't currently have anything resembling a full playing deck, we don't have the depth to adequately cover the missing players, and our game plan has been absolutely woeful at times.

There are definitely things that need addressing - but we're not as far away as it seems.

 

[DJ75]

Have a look at the list of teams we were a bee's dick away from beating last year - Melbourne, Collingwood, Sydney...

Sydney are a mile ahead of every other team in the competition this year. In 2024 we have beaten Carlton (currently 2nd), and Port (4th). We lost to Collingwood (6th), in Melbourne, by less than a goal. So yes, with a full playing deck and a competent game plan, I think we'd be very competitive against every team other than Sydney.

Unlike teams like Collingwood, we don't have the depth/experience to cover injuries to our key players. We lost Tex, Thilthorpe and Himmelberg, and our replacements are Burgess & Gollant (or shifting Borlase from defence). We lost Rankine, and had to replace him with McHenry. Murray is the only player for whom we have reasonable quality replacements, and even then Murray is still a huge upgrade on all of our current KPDs.

The fact is that we don't currently have anything resembling a full playing deck, we don't have the depth to adequately cover the missing players, and our game plan has been absolutely woeful at times.

There are definitely things that need addressing - but we're not as far away as it seems.

I very much disagree.

We have beaten Port regularly. Outside of that, it is West Coast, North, and not much else. We got lucky against Carlton in that we took the lead without enough time left to blow the game.
We don't beat Collingwood, or Melbourne, or Essendon, or Bulldogs, or Richmond, or Hawthorn, or Fremantle, or Geelong, or GWS, or Gold Coast, or St. Kilda.....
We aren't close. At all.

 

[FullyBigKPro]

Our close results against the top teams over the last 2 years, where we've lost multiple games against top-8 teams by less than a goal, suggests that we're not too far off. However, the players are not currently performing anywhere near that level - and the players who carried the bulk of the burden during that period (e.g. Walker) are now rapidly approaching the end.

There are definitely issues which need to be addressed - not the least of which is the game plan which Nicks tried to implement at the start of the year.

With a decent game plan (like we had last year), and a decent run with injuries (we're currently missing Walker, Rankine, Crouch, Worrell, Thilthorpe, and Murray from our best 22), and we have the ability to go deep into the finals. Without those elements, as we are at present, we find ourselves in the bottom-4. We're not that far away - but at the moment it feels like we're light years off.

Last year really flattered us I think.

Walker had a ridiculous career best year, we had a dream run with injuries AND we had 4 wins against WC and North who were god awful.

The problem with the 'AFL' competition is that you only need to be 5 - 10% 'off' and its the difference between challenging for finals or bottom 4.

A few injuries, horrendous coaching and players out of form/haven't developed - Bang = Crows bottom 4. *And thats not even going into all the structural/Key person issues we have off field.

 

[Vader]

I very much disagree.

We have beaten Port regularly. Outside of that, it is West Coast, North, and not much else. We got lucky against Carlton in that we took the lead without enough time left to blow the game.
We don't beat Collingwood, or Melbourne, or Essendon, or Bulldogs, or Richmond, or Hawthorn, or Fremantle, or Geelong, or GWS, or Gold Coast, or St. Kilda.....
We aren't close. At all.

How about you take a look at our actual results...

We beat Carlton (2nd) and Port (4th). We lost to Essendon (3rd) and Collingwood (6th) by less than a goal. We were one umpiring blunder away from winning the Essendon game. Anyone who thinks that our best isn't good enough to match it with the top teams has rocks in their head.

Don't get me wrong, we're not currently playing anywhere near our best - partly due to players being MIA to injury (and a lack of replacement depth), partly because of the game plan. However, our best is definitely good enough.

I'm not saying that our best would be good enough to beat the 2024 Sydney team, but it's certainly good enough to challenge any of the other likely finalists.

 

[Scorpus]

How about you take a look at our actual results...

We beat Carlton (2nd) and Port (4th). We lost to Essendon (3rd) and Collingwood (6th) by less than a goal. We were one umpiring blunder away from winning the Essendon game. Anyone who thinks that our best isn't good enough to match it with the top teams has rocks in their head.

Don't get me wrong, we're not currently playing anywhere near our best - partly due to players being MIA to injury (and a lack of replacement depth), partly because of the game plan. However, our best is definitely good enough.

I'm not saying that our best would be good enough to beat the 2024 Sydney team, but it's certainly good enough to challenge any of the other likely finalists.

Our best is good enough to get close but lose. Consistently.

 

[GreyCrow]

Have a look at the list of teams we were a bee's dick away from beating last year - Melbourne, Collingwood, Sydney...

Sydney are a mile ahead of every other team in the competition this year. In 2024 we have beaten Carlton (currently 2nd), and Port (4th). We lost to Collingwood (6th), in Melbourne, by less than a goal. So yes, with a full playing deck and a competent game plan, I think we'd be very competitive against every team other than Sydney.

Unlike teams like Collingwood, we don't have the depth/experience to cover injuries to our key players. We lost Tex, Thilthorpe and Himmelberg, and our replacements are Burgess & Gollant (or shifting Borlase from defence). We lost Rankine, and had to replace him with McHenry. Murray is the only player for whom we have reasonable quality replacements, and even then Murray is still a huge upgrade on all of our current KPDs.

The fact is that we don't currently have anything resembling a full playing deck, we don't have the depth to adequately cover the missing players, and our game plan has been absolutely woeful at times.

There are definitely things that need addressing - but we're not as far away as it seems.

We lost Rankine and Tex for our block of ' weaker opponents '

Stop polishing a turd

 

[Vader]

The problem with the 'AFL' competition is that you only need to be 5 - 10% 'off' and its the difference between challenging for finals or bottom 4.

A few injuries, horrendous coaching and players out of form/haven't developed - Bang = Crows bottom 4. *And thats not even going into all the structural/Key person issues we have off field.

... and there's the common sense. People say we're miles off it, when all it takes is being 5-10% off - and that's all we really are off it. Norf really are miles off it, but we're just missing that 5-10%.

Walker's back problems have really hampered him this year. Thilthorpe & Murray haven't played a game yet, and the best of the back-up KPFs (Himmelberg) has also been MIA for the last couple of weeks. Then there's Rankine, who is irreplaceable in both our midfield & forward line, and Crouch's ability to win the ball in the packs. Subtract those, and throw in replacements who are barely AFL standard at best (McHenry, Burgess, Gollant, Sholl, Schoenberg), and there's your 5-10%.

... and then there's Nicks' godawful game plan from the first few rounds.

 

[Captain Furious]

I must admit I'm confused about the idea of getting Parker and Yeo - not because I think they are not quality - they are - but the suggested idea that they are going to be there to help teach our up and coming midfield.

I would think that is Laird and Crouch role

If we are getting them for any other reason then we have failed our development or drafting

It's really not a good look for the club either way

You prefer our young kids play like Laird and Crouch or Luke Parker?

Couldn’t care less whether it’s a ‘good look’. Just want our mids to be better.

 

[Vader]

Our best is good enough to get close but lose. Consistently.

In 2024 we're currently one umpiring blunder (bad enough to be acknowledged by the AFL) away from having a 3-3 record against teams in the top-8.

 

[Crow till I die]

Our best is good enough to get close but lose. Consistently.

Yep.

IF we nail the off season (ie assumes we finish as low as we can to get the best draft pick), draft a top end mid, get Welsh, Bring in a decent ruck and possibly get a good free agent, our best side will be good. Its the coaching and game plan that need to change and a new voice with a new plan A B & C is what is now needed to move the club forward

 

[GreyCrow]

You prefer our young kids play like Laird and Crouch or Luke Parker?

Couldn’t care less whether it’s a ‘good look’. Just want our mids to be better.

I don't want Laird or Crouch near the AFL side

But I know as do you that Parker and Yeo won't be running around in the sanfl teaching our middle

They will be sharing time with Laird Crouch and Dawson

 

[Vader]

We lost Rankine and Tex for our block of ' weaker opponents '

Stop polishing a turd

... and Crouch, and Worrell.

Maybe you don't realise just how undermanned our team has been over the last couple of weeks - and just how big the gulf is between the missing players and their replacements?

Missing over the last few weeks (but present for the earlier games against the quality sides)..
Rankine -> McHenry
Walker -> Borlase
Crouch -> Schoenberg
Worrell -> Sholl
Himmelberg -> Burgess

Do you see the importance of the missing players, and how shite their replacements are? This is the 5-10% that dropped us from being a team good enough to challenge the top teams, to being woeful against the crap teams.

 

[maxlilly]

You prefer our young kids play like Laird and Crouch or Luke Parker?

Couldn’t care less whether it’s a ‘good look’. Just want our mids to be better.

Maybe if we played our young mids in the midfield,they might get better

 

[GreyCrow]

... and Crouch, and Worrell.

Maybe you don't realise just how undermanned our team has been over the last couple of weeks - and just how big the gulf is between the missing players and their replacements?

Missing over the last few weeks (but present for the earlier games against the quality sides)..
Rankine -> McHenry
Walker -> Borlase
Crouch -> Schoenberg
Worrell -> Sholl
Himmelberg -> Burgess

Do you see the importance of the missing players, and how shite their replacements are? This is the 5-10% that dropped us from being a team good enough to challenge the top teams, to being woeful against the crap teams.

OUR WEAKEST BLOCK OF GAMES AND WE BOTTLED IT

 

[jackster83]

... and Crouch, and Worrell.

Maybe you don't realise just how undermanned our team has been over the last couple of weeks - and just how big the gulf is between the missing players and their replacements?

Missing over the last few weeks (but present for the earlier games against the quality sides)..
Rankine -> McHenry
Walker -> Borlase
Crouch -> Schoenberg
Worrell -> Sholl
Himmelberg -> Burgess

Do you see the importance of the missing players, and how shite their replacements are? This is the 5-10% that dropped us from being a team good enough to challenge the top teams, to being woeful against the crap teams.

We were 0-4 with a minimal injury list.

 

[maxlilly]

Does Borlase get a new contract for next year with the improvement and flexibility he has shown this year ?

 

[Drugs Are Bad Mackay?]

I saw Dawson reposting one of Luke Parkers wifes business posts on social media over the weekend and thought that was a bit strange.

Parker is 32 in October. Wife looks to have a successful business in Sydney.

Enough evidence for me

 

[Crow till I die]

Does Borlase get a new contract for next year with the improvement and flexibility he has shown this year ?

It shouldn't even be up for debate. He has earned an extension imo.

 

[FullyBigKPro]

... and Crouch, and Worrell.

Maybe you don't realise just how undermanned our team has been over the last couple of weeks - and just how big the gulf is between the missing players and their replacements?

Missing over the last few weeks (but present for the earlier games against the quality sides)..
Rankine -> McHenry
Walker -> Borlase
Crouch -> Schoenberg
Worrell -> Sholl
Himmelberg -> Burgess

Do you see the importance of the missing players, and how shite their replacements are? This is the 5-10% that dropped us from being a team good enough to challenge the top teams, to being woeful against the crap teams.

I think its too simplistic to blame injuries alone... Rankine and Worrell IMO have been the biggest outs and have hurt us. Walker hasn't been the same this year, granted he's still good for a few goals and takes a good opponent but he hasn't ripped a game to shreds this year.

Biggest issue is coaching, gameplan, poor drafting, poor development and a mentally weak culture thats been ingrained in for years.