List Mgmt. 2024 List Mismanagement and Trading

[Soggy2112]

Bullshit!!!

You don't win 2 VFL Frosty Miller Medals in successive years in a strong competition like the VFL with AFL listed players as your opposition most weeks if you're awful...far from it. He;s kicked goals in 4 of his 7 AFL games this year including a bag of 3 against the Hawks and 2 against the Dockers. Whether you want to believe it or not he's good depth.

Jim 'Frosty' Miller Medal - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

My question would be, what’s the point in having a 29 year old as depth when we aren’t going to contend?

 

[Mutineer]

My question would be, what’s the point in having a 29 year old as depth when we aren’t going to contend?

An 18 year old key forward isn't going to offer much leadership or direction to the other young forwards in the SANFL....He's OK as a depth option for a couple of years.

 

[maxlilly]

By that logic we’d never delist anyone.

Fog and Sholl showed attributes in their early careers that suggested they had potential to be high level performers and were worth persisting with.

What has Gollant shown?

I reckon Gollant has shown enough to get 5-6 games in a row.
Unfortunately it hasn't happened.
I didn't mind him playing forward and doing the chop out ruck, it gave us some more speed and mobility around the ground.
If Tex doesn't go on next year and Himmelberg leaves, who we playing up there ?

 

[1970crow]

My question would be, what’s the point in having a 29 year old as depth when we aren’t going to contend?

We don’t think we’re contending, pretty sure our brains trust believe very differently.

 

[Bazz_27]

Himmelberg has kicked 1 more goal than Burgess this year from the same number of games

Not sure there's as much difference as people make it seem

Burgess kicked 3 goals after half time vs hawthorn, had 3 touches in the first half with 1 mark. His goals were absolute junk when the pressure was off. That is nearly half of his goals for the year.

We also won 1 of 7 games when he played

 

[Scorpus]

Burgess kicked 3 goals after half time vs hawthorn, had 3 touches in the first half with 1 mark. His goals were absolute junk when the pressure was off. That is nearly half of his goals for the year.

We also won 1 of 7 games when he played

True, though if you're not counting junk goals we'd have to remove Himmelberg's 2 goals against North

 

[Bazz_27]

True, though if you're not counting junk goals we'd have to remove Himmelberg's 2 goals against North

I'm not a fan of either. EH has actually shown something for the first time since coming back from injury.. reckon that's why Tex is out managed personally

 

[1990crow]

I'm not a fan of either. EH has actually shown something for the first time since coming back from injury.. reckon that's why Tex is out managed personally

He's probably gone anyway.

 

[Crows I Am]

Why do ppl think just because someone's out of the side it's a guarantee they'll be delisted. Sholl was a regular, then he was on the outer for almost a whole season and then was re signed. Crouch similar. Hamill similar.

People also reckon Gollant will be delisted but how long did it take fog to come good? He's just hit some good form in the twos now as well. Won't be surprised if he gets another 2 years.

We have to delist someone, and Gollant has had enough time to show what he can do. If we had the luxury of having him sit on our list another year then sure keep him to see if it all clicks. But we need to bring in new talent and to do that you need to make room on the list.

He may get lucky and get put on to the Rookie list.

 

[Vader]

Bullshit!!!

You don't win 2 VFL Frosty Miller Medals in successive years in a strong competition like the VFL with AFL listed players as your opposition most weeks if you're awful...far from it. He;s kicked goals in 4 of his 7 AFL games this year including a bag of 3 against the Hawks and 2 against the Dockers. Whether you want to believe it or not he's good depth.

Jim 'Frosty' Miller Medal - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

I'm not talking about his VFL history. I'm talking about what they each produced, when given the opportunity in the Adelaide forward line in 2024.

Both were awful - Borlase, less so.

 

[Vader]

I reckon Gollant has shown enough to get 5-6 games in a row.
Unfortunately it hasn't happened.
I didn't mind him playing forward and doing the chop out ruck, it gave us some more speed and mobility around the ground.
If Tex doesn't go on next year and Himmelberg leaves, who we playing up there ?

We gave him 3 games in a row, from R13-15. Gollant's form was such that he demanded to be dropped.

 

[ABAB]

Yes. Up to us to bring the mid group closer if we want to be successful.

We've closed the gap considerably with Soligo and Rankine this year and Rachele was excellent when he moved into the midfield for the first 8 weeks last year but has been playing in a different role further up the ground by Nicks, neither in the midfield or forward.

 

[ABAB]

In case not already shared

Which club has the better crop of young talent - Adelaide or Port Adelaide?

“The question is, who is set up to be in a better position in the coming seasons?”

www.sen.com.au

Daniel Menzel has analysed the lists of both Adelaide and Port Adelaide to pick which club has the better youngsters.

The former Geelong and Sydney forward did the exercise by analysing both of the club’s players who are aged 26 or under and are currently in the best 22.




He found that both clubs have 11 of their 22 best players aged 26 or under at the start of 2025.

Menzel’s analysis focused on whether any of those players were already A-graders or could get there by the time they are 26 years old.

“I've had a look at Port Adelaide and the Adelaide Crows’ lists and where their team is built and their demographic age-wise,” Menzel told SEN SA Breakfast.

“The question is, who is set up to be in a better position in the coming seasons?

“For both Port and the Crows 11 of their best 22, so 50 per cent of their current team are under the age of 26.

“If you're going to have a crack at it for the next five or six years, guys that are past 26 we know a lot of them won't be there in three, four or five years’ time.

“I want to talk about whether these guys at both clubs are elite A-graders or whether they're going to get there.”

For Port Adelaide, Menzel picked Jason Horne-Francis, Connor Rozee, Zak Butters and Mitch Georgiades as players who were already A-graders or could get there by 26 years old.

For the Crows, he picked five names - Max Michalanney, Josh Rachele, Jake Soligo, Riley Thilthorpe and Izak Rankine under the same criteria.

While he thinks Adelaide has one more player than Port Adelaide who can enter that top echelon, he would rather have the Power’s list going forward given the sheer firepower of Rozee, Butters and Horne-Francis out of the middle.

“In terms of absolute A-grade elite that you can build your club around I've got four for Port Adelaide and five for the Crows. It is very, very close,” Menzel said.

“There are a lot of very close to A-grade players in there … I actually think both of these lists are in a great position for in a couple of years’ time to be able to contend.

“It is so crucial with Tasmania coming into the competition in that period that the next two to three drafts and trade periods for the Crows and Port are massive because they will be thereabouts in two-or-three-years’ time.

“The question was, who are you taking? I am going to go with, by a hair, Port Adelaide.

“The reason being is, I'm going to back in the sheer firepower of Port Adelaide's three gun midfielders in Horne-Francis, Rozee and Butters that you can build around them.”

Listen to Menzel’s full analysis of the young guns at both clubs here.

Interesting, I thought their list was meant to be in the premiership window lol. You can't build around Soligo, Rankine and Dawson in the midfield????

 

[Cap]

We do need to cull a few though or we'll end up with a massive list squeeze again.

Sloane - retired
Parnell - delisted
Himmelberg - trade/FA
One of Gollant/Burgess - delisted
McHenry - delisted

If Berry stays, I'd be cutting Schoenberg.

Can't we do the ole , throw on the rookie list for him?

Not sure if that impacts the contract

I'm not sold he is a complete bust, he has shown a bit

 

[1990crow]

Interesting, I thought their list was meant to be in the premiership window lol. You can't build around Soligo, Rankine and Dawson in the midfield????

Dawson is going to be 28 next year. Whilst he will be a part of it for the next couple of years at least (hopefully as we go up the ladder), long term he will be a outside player.
Soligo is good, but TBC whether he is capable of A grade potential.

Still feel it lacks an out and out A grade talent.

 

[maxlilly]

We gave him 3 games in a row, from R13-15. Gollant's form was such that he demanded to be dropped.

I don't think that's right.
He played a couple of games at the start of the year when we were terrible, and has not been seen again

 

[rabidcrow]

Wasn't EH injured when we tried Borlase in the forward line......

I'm hoping we never see Borlase in our forward line ever again.

He had a busted cheekbone for 3 weeks.


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[crows dude]

I don't think that's right.
He played a couple of games at the start of the year when we were terrible, and has not been seen again

Yep
Rnd 2 6 and 7

Vader is looking at his gams played rather than round

 

[Soggy2112]

An 18 year old key forward isn't going to offer much leadership or direction to the other young forwards in the SANFL....He's OK as a depth option for a couple of years.

1 - you’re assuming that just because he’s old he’ll make a good leader/teacher. That is not the case.

2 - Providing direction and teaching forward craft is why we pay those guys that sit in the boxes each game. Dedicating a list spot for someone to do that is silly.

3 - Why do we need someone in the reserves to specifically give young key forwards direction? Let’s use Welsh as an example, the SANFL is not the place for him to develop, if he shows any signs he’s ready he should be in the AFL ASAP, and if he needs a stint in the 2s to find form, that’s all it is, to find form.

4 - Why do we even need to concern ourselves with depth? If we were contending it makes sense, but we’re not. The Hawks have run with only one key forward for a lot of their games and they’re developing really well. You could argue that it actually forced them to find different ways of moving the ball forward and has helped them be more creative and unpredictable.

5 - We discussed a while ago the need for the club to be investing in a young ruck or two to replace ROB and we need to do it yesterday. If we’re not willing to cut loose someone like Burgess where do you suggest we get the list spots to do that?

 

[rabidcrow]

How many of those are kick ins?

I’m a Keane fan but I don’t think you can read too much into that.

Average 3 per week


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[Mutineer]

1 - you’re assuming that just because he’s old he’ll make a good leader/teacher. That is not the case.

2 - Providing direction and teaching forward craft is why we pay those guys that sit in the boxes each game. Dedicating a list spot for someone to do that is silly.

3 - Why do we need someone in the reserves to specifically give young key forwards direction? Let’s use Welsh as an example, the SANFL is not the place for him to develop, if he shows any signs he’s ready he should be in the AFL ASAP, and if he needs a stint in the 2s to find form, that’s all it is, to find form.

4 - Why do we even need to concern ourselves with depth? If we were contending it makes sense, but we’re not. The Hawks have run with only one key forward for a lot of their games and they’re developing really well. You could argue that it actually forced them to find different ways of moving the ball forward and has helped them be more creative and unpredictable.

5 - We discussed a while ago the need for the club to be investing in a young ruck or two to replace ROB and we need to do it yesterday. If we’re not willing to cut loose someone like Burgess where do you suggest we get the list spots to do that?

We'llhave to agree to disagree.

Plenty of young AFL drafted key forwards do an apprenticeship at SANFL/VFL/WAFL level and whilst you might not rate on field leadership at SANFL/VFL/WAFL plenty do. it's no different to Tex at AFL level.

 

[Carmo]

Burgess is a Crows supporter, he's exactly the kind of person to hang around on a pittance contract and be happy to get the odd game to provide a bit of depth while realistically eventually making way for younger players. You need a few of those guys on your list.

 

[Crow till I die]

Burgess is a Crows supporter, he's exactly the kind of person to hang around on a pittance contract and be happy to get the odd game to provide a bit of depth while realistically eventually making way for younger players. You need a few of those guys on your list.

Can't argue there and he can do a job if called on.

 

[Soggy2112]

We'llhave to agree to disagree.

Plenty of young AFL drafted key forwards do an apprenticeship at SANFL/VFL/WAFL level and whilst you might not rate on field leadership at SANFL/VFL/WAFL plenty do. it's no different to Tex at AFL level.

It’s not so much that I don’t rate on field leadership. It’s that I question the logic that just because someone has been around the system for a long time means they automatically provide that.

Tex is a former captain and an expert in forward craft. Maybe Burgess is a great leader but I haven’t heard anyone actually say that, or witnessed it on field.

 

[Mutineer]

It’s not so much that I don’t rate on field leadership. It’s that I question the logic that just because someone has been around the system for a long time means they automatically provide that.

Tex is a former captain and an expert in forward craft. Maybe Burgess is a great leader but I haven’t heard anyone actually say that, or witnessed it on field.

Well he comes from a teaching background before he was an AFL player so he has that in common with quite a few AFL coaching staff...