Game Day AFL Round 2 - Collingwood vs Richmond Matchday Discussion (MCG - 7.20pm)

[hellfire]

I would seriously consider it to be honest.

Tigers are going very small up forward. Griffiths and Riewoldt the only talls, and Griffiths really isn't set the world on fire right now.

If we have some momentum, then I'd be happy enough to give Reid a crack at it up forward as a surprise tactic.

Even against a side that is taller up forward, Dunn into the backline and Reid forward is a move we should consider. Although it might be best to see how we go tonight, last week isn't a great indicator of how well our forward line will function given how strong the Dogs' defense is.

 

[DaVe86]

Scharenberg - an unfortunate calamity from the date he was selected


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In what regards do you refer?

If you are saying he was the wrong selection, then I think that's an unfairly harsh call because I thought he was clearly the right call at the time.

If you are saying he has been unlucky, then absolutely.

if you are saying the club has been poor with his injury management, then I'd disagree as well because he has had 3 very major injuries and has bounced back pretty quickly. If anything I think the club has been really good with his injury management.

if you are saying he just isn't up to it...then I'd have to respectfully say it is far too early to make that call. After 3 injury ruined years, I think Shaz is going to take a long time to get his body up to AFL standard again, and also get his pace back....and confidence in his own body.

I reckon Shaz is going ok. Just needs to build up through the VFL.

 

[MJC23]

As previously mentioned, tonight is a must win game. We can't afford to be 0-2 given our tough draw in the next month (Sydney, St Kilda, Essendon & Geelong). We just need to bring the same intensity as last week and with a little more efficiency going forward we should win.

 

[good4footy]

If the outs after round 1 were Elliott, Wells, De Goey, Varcoe, Greenwood, Sinclair all injured not many would be thinking we were a chance. At some stage the 'outs' tip you over and I hope Varcoe is not that tipping point.

This will be tight (which is a reflection of how crap i think Tigers are with our outs) but we just have to win.

 

[Bobbyt54]

With the Swans up there next week we just need to get a win tonight. Do that and we start to get some players back and we can attack the season, but lose and it makes us 0-2 with a real chance we go 0-3.

I say this just about every week but we need to make sure we take our chances tonight. No missing easy goals or easy targets. Thats the difference between us and the better sides. We leak goals over the top because of skill errors going forward and we get caught out of position. Then side who can take their chances do so and hurt us.I like the way we are trying to play but mistakes make it look bad.We hit our targets tonight I think we win by 4-5 goals.

GO PIES

 

[loki04]

If the outs after round 1 were Elliott, Wells, De Goey, Varcoe, Greenwood, Sinclair all injured not many would be thinking we were a chance. At some stage the 'outs' tip you over and I hope Varcoe is not that tipping point.

This will be tight (which is a reflection of how crap i think Tigers are with our outs) but we just have to win.

Well we haven't had access to Elliott for 12 months so the team has learnt to play without him, Wells has never even played in black and white so again team hasn't learnt to miss him.

Sinkers is another who is perennially injured and has been covered for for a long time.

Of course all make us a better side but access to some of those has been limited for a long time.

 

[Unknown Identity]

Tonight is a must win, nothing to do with Buckley's fortunes but the confidence of the players.

If we go 0-2, we then face Sydney (away), Saints (beat us comfortably last year), Essendon (demolished Hawks), then Geelong (our bitch).

If we're 0-6 or 1-5 after 6 games i think there will need to be 24 hour security added to the Westgate Bridge.

 

[loki04]

In what regards do you refer?

If you are saying he was the wrong selection, then I think that's an unfairly harsh call because I thought he was clearly the right call at the time.

If you are saying he has been unlucky, then absolutely.

if you are saying the club has been poor with his injury management, then I'd disagree as well because he has had 3 very major injuries and has bounced back pretty quickly. If anything I think the club has been really good with his injury management.

if you are saying he just isn't up to it...then I'd have to respectfully say it is far too early to make that call. After 3 injury ruined years, I think Shaz is going to take a long time to get his body up to AFL standard again, and also get his pace back....and confidence in his own body.

I reckon Shaz is going ok. Just needs to build up through the VFL.

The worry I have for Schaz is he was looking very 1 paced which in today's game is a killer.

How much pace both straight line and lateral he will gain after being injury free for a sustained period, is the question for me on how good he can become.

Has looked on the slow side and not sure he was overtly pacey to begin with in the u18 comp. Has footy smarts which can make up for it but his role will require a certain degree of actual leg pace.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

I thought I'd run the numbers on how important tonight is. What I found was amazing.

Since the league has been 18 teams in 2012 on 27 occasions teams have been 0-2. Of those 27 only 2 have gone on to play finals with one of those being by default (Carlton replacing Essendon in 2013).

Tonight is a win it just has to be or we really do kiss the season goodbye.

Six year history set, hardly resounding data. It doesnt reall matter how many teams there are in the competition, its been a 22 round season for a very long time so any data could easily go back to the time a final 8 was first established. I doubt your stats would be quite as conclusive.

 

[Timmy from Thomastown]

Tonight is a must win, nothing to do with Buckley's fortunes but the confidence of the players.

They go hand in hand. Keeping the external pressure off Bucks with wins (especially the must-wins) surely helps the players confidence.

 

[Kilmo]

If the outs after round 1 were Elliott, Wells, De Goey, Varcoe, Greenwood, Sinclair all injured not many would be thinking we were a chance. At some stage the 'outs' tip you over and I hope Varcoe is not that tipping point.

This will be tight (which is a reflection of how crap i think Tigers are with our outs) but we just have to win.

Depressing post

 

[good4footy]

Well we haven't had access to Elliott for 12 months so the team has learnt to play without him, Wells has never even played in black and white so again team hasn't learnt to miss him.

Sinkers is another who is perennially injured and has been covered for for a long time.

Of course all make us a better side but access to some of those has been limited for a long time.

You don't learn to play without out them you do the best you can without them. Our ceiling is lower without them and this will effect the level we can play.

My point being if they dropped out in one week perception would be we cant win. The reality is that we are in fact without them this week but some are bullish about us winning.

It will be a good win (just like last week would have been) but I am not confdent for those reasons - which was my point.

 

[BringouttheGimp]

Tonight is a must win, nothing to do with Buckley's fortunes but the confidence of the players.

If we go 0-2, we then face Sydney (away), Saints (beat us comfortably last year), Essendon (demolished Hawks), then Geelong (our bitch).

If we're 0-6 or 1-5 after 6 games i think there will need to be 24 hour security added to the Westgate Bridge.

Imma jump off the bsndwagon and go for 2 and 3 day benders partying like an animal without giving much thought to Collingwood.

So I win either way mate. Collingwood wins games i can watch and enjoy.. they don't win games.. i go out partying and enjoy. That's how I've approached Collingwood under the Buckley regime. And I've had a great time partying that's for sure.

 

[good4footy]

Depressing post

Sorry Kilmo. On the bright side if we win desipte that ...what a win. We went close against last years champs so hopefully we can get over Tigers. I just hope Varcoe is not the tipping point where it is just one too many out.

 

[Scodog10]

Six year history set, hardly resounding data. It doesnt reall matter how many teams there are in the competition, its been a 22 round season for a very long time so any data could easily go back to the time a final 8 was first established. I doubt your stats would be quite as conclusive.

The data pool is 27 that's plenty. Despite your need to be right your doubts are irrelevant because you're arguing against numbers not a POV. Going any further back with different parameters is pretty pointless.

The stats don't lie and according to them a loss tonight leaves us with approximately a 4% chance of making finals.

Like I said we must win and take that eventuality out of the equation.

Edit: despite it being a pointless exercise I went back to 2000 and since then 11 of 76 have made the finals after starting 0-2. In the past decade the record is 3 of 49...

 

[Unknown Identity]

Imma jump off the bsndwagon and go for 2 and 3 day benders partying like an animal without giving much thought to Collingwood.

So I win either way mate. Collingwood wins games i can watch and enjoy.. they don't win games.. i go out partying and enjoy. That's how I've approached Collingwood under the Buckley regime. And I've had a great time partying that's for sure.

 

[cleomenes]

There is no doubt that this is a crucial game for us. With Richmond ****-a-hoop after last week, and everyone suddenly seeing Martin as invincible, they are ripe for a fall. We have to lay everything on the line to get this one. If we can knock them over, the next few weeks are not quite so daunting. If we lose, those games just raise the pressure dqay by day. The terrible disposal of last week comes hme to roost with the pressure it applies to this game. Another weeek of that and the pattern of our season is established.
With an overconfident richmond, we should get this one, but if we don't, the situation will be dire.

 

[loki04]

You don't learn to play without out them you do the best you can without them. Our ceiling is lower without them and this will effect the level we can play.

My point being if they dropped out in one week perception would be we cant win. The reality is that we are in fact without them this week but some are bullish about us winning.

It will be a good win (just like last week would have been) but I am not confdent for those reasons - which was my point.

You do learn to play without them when it is over such a long period, other players fill the void.

As I said we would be better with them in but we haven't had access to 3 of them for a long time/at all so it's not a major adjustment for the current team.

 

[good4footy]

You do learn to play without them when it is over such a long period, other players fill the void.

As I said we would be better with them in but we haven't had access to 3 of them for a long time/at all so it's not a major adjustment for the current team.

Who cares what you learn to do without them, it is the level you can play at that matters. All we have learn't to do wthout them is lose. Which is the point. The replacements aren't as good as those missing. They don't play at the same level, so don't fill the void.

The discussion is about our chances this week and I have given my opinion as to why i think it will be a difficult game for us and why I am not as optimistic as others. I am hopeful that Varcoe out, on top of who else is missing, doesn't tip us over regards our capabilities to beat them.

 

[The Dawes]

If the outs after round 1 were Elliott, Wells, De Goey, Varcoe, Greenwood, Sinclair all injured not many would be thinking we were a chance. At some stage the 'outs' tip you over and I hope Varcoe is not that tipping point.

This will be tight (which is a reflection of how crap i think Tigers are with our outs) but we just have to win.

to be honest I don't reckon Richmond are that bad - last week was clearly no guide, but Prestia and Caddy are good ins & allows Martin to spend more time forward... which leads me to my main point - I'm concerned who might be able to match up on him.... or not match up on him as the case may be.
Can see him kicking another 4 this week.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

You've been drinking grapa haven't you. If we win by 56+ I'll shout you $200 worth of IGA deli.

I'm eyeing the anti pasto and cold meats

 

[BringouttheGimp]

I'm eyeing the anti pasto and cold meats

Having fun window shopping? I doubt they'll end up in your trolley though.

 

[Saintly Viewed]

Having fun window shopping? I doubt they'll end up in your trolley though.

I'm now eyeing the cheeses

 

[Kilmo]

You do learn to play without them when it is over such a long period, other players fill the void.

As I said we would be better with them in but we haven't had access to 3 of them for a long time/at all so it's not a major adjustment for the current team.

Could argue that Fas has stepped up in Elliott's absence. Fas wasn't all that popular around these boards when Elliott was fit and firing, and even in the (albeit tiny sample size) of the half of the JLT when Elliott was playing Fas was quiet.

 

[Frank Gallagher]

With the Swans up there next week we just need to get a win tonight. Do that and we start to get some players back and we can attack the season, but lose and it makes us 0-2 with a real chance we go 0-3.

I say this just about every week but we need to make sure we take our chances tonight. No missing easy goals or easy targets. Thats the difference between us and the better sides. We leak goals over the top because of skill errors going forward and we get caught out of position. Then side who can take their chances do so and hurt us.I like the way we are trying to play but mistakes make it look bad.We hit our targets tonight I think we win by 4-5 goals.

GO PIES

Lose tonight and it's 'Good Night Norma Jean' for Buckley I'm afraid, we won't come back from 0-2.