List Mgmt. 2009 trade week discussion

[sexyhunk]

I'm not sure why there are so many people keen to get rid of Blake. Without checking I get the feeling that throughout this dominant period of ours over the last three years the ruckman who has played the most games has been Blake. By that I mean, the ruckman who has carried the most load and contributed the most has been Blake, not Ottens.

When was the last time we got a full season out of Ottens?

Mumford is great around the ground - except when he doesn't get as many possessions as Blake - which was what happened in his last few games. If Blake is a liability then what was Mumford when he wasn't contributing with hit outs, possessions or even tackles?

And what does Ottens contribute when he's out injured and having to be nursed through matches?

Over the last three years Blake has carried most of the responsibility in the ruck and since being dropped and forcing his way back into the team has demonstrated an enormous capacity to generate clearances through either spot on ruck work or even winning the ball off the ground himself. And no one can criticize his disposal under immense pressure in the GF. He stood up and played like we all wished he would play.

So I'm a bit confused. We want to trade away a ruckman who played a significant role in winning a flag for us and who also played an even more significant role in helping us to get to three grand finals in a row in favour of what? Keeping one 29 year old injury prone (albeit a superstar) ruckman, a mature aged rookie who only recently developed a work ethic to lose masses of weight and become a goer around the ground but who is currently limited in the ruck, and a couple of part timers in Hawkins and Mooney.

I don't even count West in this as his only game for 2009 contributed nothing to the team.

Don't think for a moment that I think Blake is perfect - far from it! I'd like to see him average at least 15 possessions a game and take at least 3 contested marks per game on top of his 20+ hit outs, but honestly, how many AFL ruckmen average that? More importantly, I'd like to see him average a minimum of 4 tackles per game. But none of this means I don't think he contributes to the team by giving us a massive advantage in the ruck through his ability to help the team win clearance after clearance after clearance.

A ruckman's first responsibility is to give his onballers first use of the ball. If he can't win the ruck he then should contest the ball on the ground using his bigger body. Mumford contests the ball at centre bounces on the ground so much because, quite frankly, he loses more hit outs than he wins and so has to do something to make up for it. Blake is the opposite, which contributes to him having less involvement at ground level. Having said that, I have noticed that when the ball is on the ground he doesn't get in as quick as mumford, but still, he has contested plenty in the second half of the year.

i think you find is not as simple as that, he took his time signing a contract last time, some say it was dollars and some say was steven king.

he also refused to sign a contract during the year, which can only be due to the dosh as king is already gone.

i have no doubt when thompson made those comments about players having to pay cuts to stay, it was directed at blake as the out of contract players are mostly on the fringe....wont be stokes as he just showed waht a team player he was.

so the question is will be willing to make a one dimentional ruck one of the highest paid player? not easy decision as mummy was slowing down after playing 11-12 games on the trot and ottens fast becoming the geelongs own clark keating..

 

[vinum coupe]

Which mod has been going 'merge thread' crazy for the last 3 weeks.

It's bloody annoying !!!!

Anyone would think we have 30,000 posts per day on the same thing

 

[vinum coupe]

Re: Are we going to be getting rid of some players?

The one or two senior games that Gillies played, I thought straight away that this kid is going to be a star. He played exactly as Taylor does!

Gillies reminds me of David King

 

[Casey Cat]

Does anyone have proof that Blake is on $500K per year?

 

[alfy!]

a lot of crap being talked in this thread

 

[Rosso]

Does anyone have proof that Blake is on $500K per year?

I thought it was more like $300 - $350. Saints and tigers were around that mark at the end of 07 and from reports that was more so the amount being bandied around.

Not sure if he'll stay or go and if it's the latter then what clubs would be interested? Read today the West & Blake are both out of contract but big Dawson was resigned for 2 years. Not sure if the club will want to have 5 ruckman on their senior list.

 

[TheMightyAchilles]

sen muppet said enright wants out - what a lot of shite

the other major issue is the conflict on interest with mcconville as he manages blake and west

how can he act in the best interests of both i don't know
he could go in this year, and simply say
blake and west sign on if mummy is moved on, if mummy stays these 2 go

very weird, as west gains by blake moves on

 

[Turbocat]

Today's Hun linked us with Drum who has apparently walked out from Freo. At 22 , he is probably not a bad fit but for , 1 what would they want and 2 ,I'd think he would have to be costly than just picking up a green kid and we are already squeezed for Cap dollars.

Any one think this is realistic or is it just paper talk as per usual for this time of year.

 

[bulletproof]

Today's Hun linked us with Drum who has apparently walked out from Freo. At 22 , he is probably not a bad fit but for , 1 what would they want and 2 ,I'd think he would have to be costly than just picking up a green kid and we are already squeezed for Cap dollars.

Any one think this is realistic or is it just paper talk as per usual for this time of year.

I am not one for getting players from other clubs but I do believe talented key defenders, who have stalled, is the exception. They often flourish at other clubs, I am thinking of our own Tommy Harley, the Wakelins, Craig Bolton, Mal Michael etc.

I would definitely take him, if he can be fit in the cap on a small salary. I liked him as youngster. So did Wells.

 

[Shmoses]

If we end up getting rid of Mumford and keeping Blake my gut feeling is that we would regret it a lot more than if we went the opposite direction

 

[meto]

If we end up getting rid of Mumford and keeping Blake my gut feeling is that we would regret it a lot more than if we went the opposite direction

I think that's true, although with 3 proper pre-seasons and at 22- 23 yrs, you'd expect Mumford to mature as a senior this year.
None of this, crap about him getting tired as if he was some raw 18 yr old.
Come on either he's got what they want as a hard in and under type ruckman, or you gotta move him on.
Blake has matured and has shown aggression and desire to be in the Premiership team.
I'd hate to develop the guy only to give him up as a v good mature senior ruckman.
If they aren't sure about Mumford by now then he can go if he's chasing the money, and we keep Blake, who is the preferred senior of 2009.
As for Marcus Drum, if he's anything like his old man was, go get him.

 

[Geelong2k9]

I think that's true, although with 3 proper pre-seasons and at 22- 23 yrs, you'd expect Mumford to mature as a senior this year.
None of this, crap about him getting tired as if he was some raw 18 yr old.
Come on either he's got what they want as a hard in and under type ruckman, or you gotta move him on.
Blake has matured and has shown aggression and desire to be in the Premiership team.
I'd hate to develop the guy only to give him up as a v good mature senior ruckman.
If they aren't sure about Mumford by now then he can go if he's chasing the money, and we keep Blake, who is the preferred senior of 2009.
As for Marcus Drum, if he's anything like his old man was, go get him.

Who is Marcus Drum's old man??? I only know of Damian Drum as the uncle.....

 

[Maximus76]

Fire Sale

The cats need to think very carefully on where they send players if they need to have a fire sale this year as they did in 2007. IF we do have to off load players we cannot send decent players to our main rivals.

I am really worried that gamble is going to be traded as I really rate this bloke - same as for d.jonno. Does anyone know their contract status?

if we do have to move on and hand these players away for nothing then we need to send them to bottom 4 clubs.

Prismal still burns....i loved his style of play

 

[hamG]

Re: Fire Sale

On one level I agree, no more free handouts of our talent.

But at the same time I was so annoyed we gave King to St Kilda for nothing while watching them facepalm us on the ladder this year. And oh how King was shithouse in the GF so in a twisted way ultimately it worked out for us in the best possible way

Lonergan, Tenace, DJ, Gamble, DJK, Stokes + one ruckman. Something has gotta give this year unfortunately and it will come from those names.

 

[Cohzee]

Re: Fire Sale

As long as we gain something from it, I don't care.

 

[meto]

Who is Marcus Drum's old man??? I only know of Damian Drum as the uncle.....

Near enough I'd reckon.

 

[True Blue Cat]

Re: Fire Sale

I still can't believe we gave Prismall away for nothing. I thought he would advance to become 1 of the best midfielders in the competition learning a lot from the other midfielders at Geelong. Not only was i disappointed we lost him but i was extremely annoyed that we gave him away. So i am not 100% in caring who players go to as long as we don't give them away. All of this within reason though...

 

[vinum coupe]

I've been thinking about this and I reckon there are two types of players that they keep drafting.

Guys capable of playing the flanks and pockets at both ends. (that will end up as midfielders. And classy ones)

eg; the way ablett, chapman, kelly started. And as Varcoe is now.

Until we unearth our next excellent crop of mids. These guys wont hit their straps for 4-5 years so it would be great find 4 excellent players over the next 2 years.

They would end up pushing out players like stokes and byrnes.

 

[vinum coupe]

Here's one for you

Aaron Davey.

Gee I'd like him in the side.

Surely we could get that done. Melbourne want mumford. Throw in Tenace and DJ and we're done

 

[hbk_aus]

Re: Fire Sale

I still can't believe we gave Prismall away for nothing. I thought he would advance to become 1 of the best midfielders in the competition learning a lot from the other midfielders at Geelong. Not only was i disappointed we lost him but i was extremely annoyed that we gave him away. So i am not 100% in caring who players go to as long as we don't give them away. All of this within reason though...

And i still cant believe people dont understand that he wouldnt sign a new contract, so if we didnt take what was offered we wouldve got nothing for him....

 

[DanA]

Here's one for you

Aaron Davey.

Gee I'd like him in the side.

Surely we could get that done. Melbourne want mumford. Throw in Tenace and DJ and we're done

Where does he play?

It will take either Byrnes or Varcoe out of the side or if you want to play him back Hunt/Kelly. I think I'd pass on Davey. Either draft picks or a youngish KP backmen like Drum or Henderson. Not much else is needed.

 

[kriso182]

Re: Fire Sale

I still can't believe we gave Prismall away for nothing.

We swapped Prismall for pick 39, which we used for Steven Motlop. Who knows this could be a winner in the future!

 

[vinum coupe]

Well this is how I would do it. Many, many wouldn't.

09 Grand Final team
B: Darren Milburn – Matthew Scarlett – Corey Enright
HB: Tom Harley – Harry Taylor – Andrew Mackie
C: Joel Corey – Cameron Ling – James Kelly
HF: Jimmy Bartel – Cameron Mooney – Steve Johnson
F: Travis Varcoe – Tom Hawkins – Paul Chapman
Foll: Mark Blake – Joel Selwood – Gary Ablett
Int: Brad Ottens, Shannon Byrnes, Max Rooke, David Wojcinski
Emerg: Shane Mumford, Simon Hogan, Mathew Stokes

10 Grand final team

B: Darren Milburn – Matthew Scarlett – Corey Enright
HB: Tom Gillies – Harry Taylor – Andrew Mackie
C: Joel Corey – Cameron Ling – James Kelly
HF: Jimmy Bartel – Cameron Mooney – Steve Johnson
F: Aaron Davey – Tom Hawkins – Paul Chapman
Foll: Mark Blake – Joel Selwood – Gary Ablett
Int: Brad Ottens, Max Rooke, Travis Varcoe, Josh Hunt
Emerg: Shane Mumford, Simon Hogan, Shannon Byrnes

Out: Harley, Wojcinski, Stokes

11 Grand final team

B: Josh Hunt– Matthew Scarlett – Corey Enright
HB: Tom Gillies – Harry Taylor – Andrew Mackie
C: Joel Corey – Cameron Ling – James Kelly
HF: Jimmy Bartel – Mitch Brown– Steve Johnson
F: Aaron Davey – Tom Hawkins – Paul Chapman
Foll: Mark Blake – Joel Selwood – Gary Ablett
Int: Shane Mumford, Max Rooke, Travis Varcoe, Laidler
Emerg: , Simon Hogan, Shannon Byrnes, Motlop

Out: Milburn, Mooney, Ottens


Man that was hard to do.
Can't see any of it happening. Couldn't even get Hogan and Byrnes a game.


But it does show some big changes to older guys by 2011

 

[cats2rise]

I think that's true, although with 3 proper pre-seasons and at 22- 23 yrs, you'd expect Mumford to mature as a senior this year.
None of this, crap about him getting tired as if he was some raw 18 yr old.
Come on either he's got what they want as a hard in and under type ruckman, or you gotta move him on.
Blake has matured and has shown aggression and desire to be in the Premiership team.
I'd hate to develop the guy only to give him up as a v good mature senior ruckman.
If they aren't sure about Mumford by now then he can go if he's chasing the money, and we keep Blake, who is the preferred senior of 2009.
As for Marcus Drum, if he's anything like his old man was, go get him.

Three years ago he was 130kgs....

He showed this year he was fit, but would still be a pre season behind other key talls his age because of his original size I would think. 2009 was the first year he was fit enough to play AFL... Id love to see him next year before making a judgment.

 

[hamG]

11 Grand final team

B: Josh Hunt– Matthew Scarlett – Corey Enright
HB: Tom Gillies – Matthew Egan – Andrew Mackie
C: Joel Corey – Cameron Ling – James Kelly
HF: Jimmy Bartel – Mitch Brown– Steve Johnson
F: Harry Taylor – Tom Hawkins – Paul Chapman
Foll: Mark Blake – Joel Selwood – Gary Ablett
Int: Shane Mumford, Max Rooke, Travis Varcoe, Aaron Davey
Emerg: , Simon Hogan, Shannon Byrnes, Motlop

Edited for hopefulness