List Mgmt. 2019 Trade Thread - Part V

[bird_man]

People don't care for stats when they won't support their argument.

I'm ok with the Jones acquisition. I like him.

My argument here is the value discrepancy between the two. It's massively skewed if the media reports are correct.

Also I think people have unfair expectation on what Jones will produce. I don't think they fully understand what they're getting. I think they think he will be the big inside mid we are missing. Hes never been that for Sydney. He's been the defensive sweeper. He also has issues with decision making and disposal.

Like acres he's never been able to perform as a genuine inside mid.

No, I don't care for stats when they don't tell the full story.

As I said, Acres wouldn't be best 22 round 1 IMO, Jones is a walk up start.

That makes him worth more.

And the difference between a late 2nd and a future 3rd really isn't a lot when you consider that.

I've seen plenty of Jones and I know exactly what we are getting.

 

[DarkSaint]

Not necessarily. The club could just to frontload Howard, Hill, Jones etc a bit more aggressively. You can kick the can down the road, fairly easily, with cap space.

That's true, but id be very surprised if we couldn't fit them all in even if we heavily front load them with the loss of the following Steven/Longer/Armo. You would think them alone would be around 1.7 Mill Steven 800k Armo 600K and Longer 400K when they all signed...

 

[StCicatriz]

I look at Jones for one thing - pace. If we are going to play Carlisle, Howard, Wilke and Battle in the same backline, then you need real pace to add to that. I can see one side of the ground reading Jones/Hill/Butler - that gives us the very potent ability to move the ball very quickly from defence to attack. Acres does not give you pace.

Jones for mine should play the Robertson role at Brisbane. The defensive winger. Which is how we've used Clark this year and Acres last year.

Clark needs to transition into a mid. Either a cotchin or Whitfield. So either classy inside mid or a classy winger.

But I think if people are going into the acquisition of Jones and thinking he will be vastly better than Acres I think they're setting themselves up for disappointment. Especially if they think he's the big inside mid we are missing.

 

[From 45]

Let's be honest he's not a 35-50 goal a year forward, he hasn't kicked 50 since 2015 his highest since then is 38. He's a 35-38 goal forward. He's very cover-able in that regard.

I think you also have to factor in that he also provides a contest in the f50 for our small forwards that lead to goals or score involvement.

He also provides a contest further up the ground be it as a high forward or when in the ruck. He has a fantastic areobic ability and work ethic .

He also provides cover when floating down back and helps out.

All of the above shows he can play multiple roles and based on that he is worth more than pick 32

 

[bird_man]

I hate trade radio, but I have listened to Dal and McLure every day and think they've been bloody good to listen to, especially considering the lack of action.

 

[marcus1232]

Jones for mine should play the Robertson role at Brisbane. The defensive winger. Which is how we've used Clark this year and Acres last year.

Clark needs to transition into a mid. Either a cotchin or Whitfield. So either classy inside mid or a classy winger.

But I think if people are going into the acquisition of Jones and thinking he will be vastly better than Acres I think they're setting themselves up for disappointment. Especially if they think he's the big inside mid we are missing.

completely different players to one another

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Don’t care in the slightest to be honest , we Wanted Hill

Big fan of Blake too , but look at differently , we are changing our team over next 2 years


Wish our supporters would look at Marshall ( cost nothing ) Wilkie ( cost nothing ) when doing comparisons.

When we are lucky enough to find a Marshall or a Wilkie , it should be the icing on the cake of all our early draft selections.

 

[StCicatriz]

In isolation the Hill trade (if correctly reported) looks overs - rating Acres as a late second pick it's basically 10 + 12 with a third back; so more expensive (just) than say, Shiel. I'm thinking the future third goes to Richmond for Butler

But we did well (I thought) out of Howard + Ryder so if I'm right about Butler; if you consider it's 6 + 58 + Acres + future second for Hill, Howard, Butler and Ryder it looks a whole lot better.

I'm guessing we threw in 58 because all our late picks are being used for upgrades so it's not really relevant where they are.

I'm hoping the acres trade is tied up in another pick swap.

Freo might not have any use for any more 2nd rounder this year or next.

I'm doping we can get something around 34 coming back with Acres. Which would negate the future 2nd.

So the Hill trade going through will look great for Freo

Then when the acres trade goes through we see it a bit more even. Where we get an ok return on Acres.

 

[DarkSaint]

I might have an ITK here... Hearing from a source that Carlton are into Newnes....

 

[TassieSaint]

If the Hill deal is what's reported we're being taken to the cleaners. Would much rather go without him.

 

[StCicatriz]

completely different players to one another

Where do you see him playing?

 

[CHBench]

Tim Gossage said Acres had signed the paper work and agreed to the deal.

Acres hasn't even toured the facilities or done the medical.

Now that we know it's a salary dump, I hope he accepts. 2nd round & 58 thrown in with it is too much though.

If we are looking at "the 6th player", I don't see what valuable commodities we have to actually do anything once Butler and Jones are done.

 

[bird_man]

With a 3rd rounder and two 4ths next year, we will have a nice opportunity to move up the draft with the amount of clubs looking for academy picks.

 

[bird_man]

Where do you see him playing?

Back flank/wing/on ball for me

 

[SaintsSeptember]

Basically the only year Jones surpassed Acres was 2019. Acres out performed Jones the last 4.

The big change? Acres played solely forward this year.

I'm not a big fan of acres either. I'm a fan of Jones.

But Jones is not the superior player people think he is. I've watched him closely since he was drafted. The things people find frustrating about Blake are the same things Jones exhibits. You're just looking at a player with forward ability vs a player who is more defensive.

What do you think of the chance of Jones playing midfield in a team that doesn't have Kennedy, Parker and Hewett?

 

[mighty_sainters]

If the Hill trade is what’s being touted just do it, he would almost be a marquee signing so we need to take that opportunity even if we need to admit getting shafted a little.

 

[Keg on legs]

Have we gone after Pope yet? Apparently there's no bigger name this trade period

 

[bird_man]

I might have an ITK here... Hearing from a source that Carlton are into Newnes....

Strange they showed no interest when he was a FA, but now they are after FA cut off.

That means hed cost something unless we delist him.

 

[kernelT]

Acres a salary dump. Makes a little more sense now.

I am concerned if we need a salary dump... same if it’s freeing up a list spot when you look at the bottom 10 of our list.

Not sure why people are complaining about Acres looking at 500k... Bonar is a 400k player next year after 2 average career games.

With Acres being sent so late for a medical says we’ve been played by Bell IMO.

I don’t mind the club having a crack and shaking things up, but these moves mean that we will need to be playing finals straight away, a lot of expectations will be put on the list to perform. Fingers crossed.

 

[Ricmel]

But I think if people are going into the acquisition of Jones and thinking he will be vastly better than Acres I think they're setting themselves up for disappointment. Especially if they think he's the big inside mid we are missing.

Wouldn't think too many have him pinned as a big inside mid. He is always described as a speedy outside player. I think our inside mids are probably our strength - not that we have a Cripps but we scrap well on the inside with Dunstan, Steele, Ross to a lesser extent. Cripps has struggled against us so I feel we hold our own there and most Saints supporters would be looking more at Bytel to become our inside genius.

Jones is about pace - defensive or attacking and i think whilst he may not be an elite ball user, he is a line breaker and will enable us to implement a faster transition game plan.

 

[marcus1232]

Where do you see him playing?

I honestly think zack will play mid his speed is a real point of difference in there for our team. The way he plays is completely different to acres though I think he is a lesser jack Steven his ability to break the lines

 

[DarkSaint]

Strange they showed no interest when he was a FA, but now they are after FA cut off.

That means hed cost something unless we delist him.

That's what i was thinking. Maybe they aren't confident of getting Jack Martin and see Newnes as the next best replacement that wont cost much

 

[pebblesofsand]

Not sure why people are comparing Acres and Jones. Two completely different players.

Acres and Tomlinson is a closer match - genuine utilities who don't shine in any particular position

GWS compo for Tomlinson - Pick 40

Blake Acres and Adam Tomlinson AFL Stats Comparison

Blake Acres and Adam Tomlinson AFL Stats Comparison.

www.footywire.com

 

[Stewart66]

I hate trade radio, but I have listened to Dal and McLure every day and think they've been bloody good to listen to, especially considering the lack of action.

One of the rare times listened today Scoop was absolutely spot on with Jack Steven commentary and think
StKilda come of it well particularly on the welfare issue .

Will say however all this patting Wells on the back for trade period is going a bit early Kelly could be
a Brownlow medallist next year , trade picks have not played a game.

 

[bird_man]

What do you think of the chance of Jones playing midfield in a team that doesn't have Kennedy, Parker and Hewett?

For anyone doubting Jones can play midfield, go back and watch the Carlton and Richmond games early in the year if you have Kayo and see what you think.