List Mgmt. 2024 Trade Thread - No.1

[Winmar2Lockett]

Was widely spoken about on here. We were going to let him look around but if we didn't get band one we were matching.

Gresham was always going to look around... it wasn't us letting him look around.

Whether we matched or not was irrelevant. It's a free agent's right to look at other offers.

Just as Josh is doing now.

 

[phantom13]

Steele is a grown man & a professional athlete.

Reckon he'd be embarrassed that someone would think that he's stroppy because he's received strong feedback.

Once again, this is how unsubstantiated rumours (or to be more accurate, utter fantasies) become accepted as fact.

The anti-Lyon, ant-StK echo chamber is hard at work. Only a matter of time before Corn is onto the scent.

That’s not…

Sure thing man, sure.

 

[Yawkey way]

This is holding no-one to account. We were ****ed because we wouldn't employ people with experience or knowledge and kept extending contracts for incompetents. Just because you aren't as bad as other people doesn't mean you're good.

I wouldn't sack Lyon now, I'm giving him next year but if at the half way mark of next year we aren't looking like we are likely to finish top 8 he should come under serious pressure to resign or be moved on. Lyon has built a footy department and set some standards. I appreciate that but he's being paid as a coach not a director of footy.

If he's not good at coaching get someone with youth and ideas and keep him as a DF.

I think you’ve got this all wrong gringo. What exactly did you think Lyon was brought in to do ?.

My understanding is that he was brought in to not only coach the side but also for an honest assessment of the list. That’s been done the next step was to start cutting the deadwood and build a list and coaching team that could actually contend for a flag not just make up the numbers. We need to have a list that is capable of making the 8 and going on from there when Tassie comes in. Yet you want him gone after two and a half years if we’re not playing finals?.

I wasn’t a Lyon fan when he was appointed the first time I liked Thomas and thought he got the rough end of the pineapple. A friend of mine who played with Lyon and works in the industry told me just watch you’ll change your tune when you see what the saints can do with a top coach. He was right Lyon is the real deal and took us as close as you can get bar a little luck to winning a flag. I don’t buy the criticism one bit, we’ve turned over players, made the finals and been competitive in just about every game he’s coached. So one or two don’t like the new regime well that’s normal and they can fall into line or move on.

Lyon will get his 4 years probably more and if things proceed as planned we’ll actually have a side that can contend for a decade. If not well there are no guarantees but at least we’ll have fallen trying to do the right things, this is as far from a pelchen monorail scam as you can get.

 

[LeonardHayes87]

People need to chill out. Football like life is never as bad as it seems and never as good as it seems…. if Josh leaves, we get a first round draft pick… if he stays, then that’s fantastic too.

If it was genuine free agency and players came and went with no club compensation I could understand the flip outs but just take it easy.

 

[kernelT]

Christ.

The fact it’s even a forum topic created by a bloke who has also created *Ross Lyon: Man on a Plank:”

Says it all.

So, based off the experiences and conversations I’ve had with people who work at the club. Who make decisions.


I’m pretty confident that it’s dumb and anyone who even allows a minuscule of their brain power to consider it as any form of truth - is stupid too.

Which topic have I created arschloch?

 

[phantom13]

I think you’ve got this all wrong gringo. What exactly did you think Lyon was brought in to do ?.

My understanding is that he was brought in to not only coach the side but also for an honest assessment of the list. That’s been done the next step was to start cutting the deadwood and build a list and coaching team that could actually content for a flag not just make up the numbers. We need to have a list that is capable of making the 8 and going on from there when Tassie comes in. Yet you want him gone after two and a half years if we’re not playing finals?.

I wasn’t a Lyon fan when he was appointed the first time I liked Thomas and thought he got the rough end of the pineapple. A friend of mine who played with Lyon and works in the industry told me just watch you’ll change your tune when you see what the saints can do with a top coach. He was right Lyon is the real deal and took us as close as you can get bar a little luck to winning a flag. I don’t buy the criticism one bit, we’ve turned over players, made the finals and been competitive in just about every game he’s coached. So one or two don’t like the new regime well that’s normal and they can fall into line or move on.

Lyon will get his 4 years probably more and if things proceed as planned we’ll actually have a side that can content for a decade. If not well there are no guarantees but at least we’ll have fallen trying to do the right things, this is as far from a pelchen monorail scam as you can get.

Like it did last year?

This is the thing RIGHT here (and im not having a go at you specifically).

The list needs finishing and Ross assesed it last year and moved a few on and got a few in. This year is a regression and now that were here, we may as well properly bottom out and get a top 5 pick. Battle stays or goes, fine.

The bipolar nature of this board seems to be around whether the above is what were doing or if its a clean out rebuild and half the clowns say its not a full rebuild but then also say the list is complete shit. Well which one is it, cause if the list is pure shit then it is a full rebuild and if its not full rebuild then the list cant be complete shit.

We made finals last year and won a final in 2020, we have a sprinkling of AA players and some young emerging stars.

To me its clear the list isnt shit, its actually not bad, just needs some complimentary pieces, so maybe everyone saying all our recent results are not Ross but the list being pure trash need to figure out is Ross putting the final pieces together and maybe our current form (which might just be a development of the gameplan) isnt ALL on the players and their lack of execution (which also stacks up given some of our ball users Sincs, Nas etc).

Anyway, this has been such a pointless circle jerk.

Ill be CLEAR about what i think is happening.

Ross did his list assesment last year, hes clear on the issues and opportunities. Hes adressed them last off season and will again this season, lists are ever evolving BUT he liked most of what he saw and can see what is needed and is doing that.

This year is regression as we implement the new Rossball gamestyle (which i ****ing HATE but hopefully is not final state and i am most concerned about this specific item but Ross knows more about footy than i do so play on).

I hope anyone who bothers to read this rambling shit takes away that i am not Anti Ross, I hate Rossball but hes a very good tactical coach and i think he sees what i see with the list so all that "you just hate Ross" stuff can be canned now.

I think hes the right guy and i think he sees the value that weve got.

 

[stavro#4]

I think you’ve got this all wrong gringo. What exactly did you think Lyon was brought in to do ?.

My understanding is that he was brought in to not only coach the side but also for an honest assessment of the list. That’s been done the next step was to start cutting the deadwood and build a list and coaching team that could actually content for a flag not just make up the numbers. We need to have a list that is capable of making the 8 and going on from there when Tassie comes in. Yet you want him gone after two and a half years if we’re not playing finals?.

I wasn’t a Lyon fan when he was appointed the first time I liked Thomas and thought he got the rough end of the pineapple. A friend of mine who played with Lyon and works in the industry told me just watch you’ll change your tune when you see what the saints can do with a top coach. He was right Lyon is the real deal and took us as close as you can get bar a little luck to winning a flag. I don’t buy the criticism one bit, we’ve turned over players, made the finals and been competitive in just about every game he’s coached. So one or two don’t like the new regime well that’s normal and they can fall into line or move on.

Lyon will get his 4 years probably more and if things proceed as planned we’ll actually have a side that can content for a decade. If not well there are no guarantees but at least we’ll have fallen trying to do the right things, this is as far from a pelchen monorail scam as you can get.

This is correct.

Like it did last year?

This is the thing RIGHT here (and im not having a go at you specifically).

The list needs finishing and Ross assesed it last year and moved a few on and got a few in. This year is a regression and now that were here, we may as well properly bottom out and get a top 5 pick. Battle stays or goes, fine.

The bipolar nature of this board seems to be around whether the above is what were doing or if its a clean out rebuild and half the clowns say its not a full rebuild but then also say the list is complete shit. Well which one is it, cause if the list is pure shit then it is a full rebuild and if its not full rebuild then the list cant be complete shit.

We made finals last year and won a final in 2020, we have a sprinkling of AA players and some young emerging stars.

To me its clear the list isnt shit, its actually not bad, just needs some complimentary pieces, so maybe everyone saying all our recent results are not Ross but the list being pure trash need to figure out is Ross putting the final pieces together and maybe our current form (which might just be a development of the gameplan) isnt ALL on the players and their lack of execution (which also stacks up given some of our ball users Sincs, Nas etc).

Anyway, this has been such a pointless circle jerk.

Ill be CLEAR about what i think is happening.

Ross did his list assesment last year, hes clear on the issues and opportunities. Hes adressed them last off season and will again this season, lists are ever evolving BUT he liked most of what he saw and can see what is needed and is doing that.

This year is regression as we implement the new Rossball gamestyle (which i ****ing HATE but hopefully is not final state and i am most concerned about this specific item but Ross knows more about footy than i do so play on).

I hope anyone who bothers to read this rambling shit takes away that i am not Anti Ross, I hate Rossball but hes a very good tactical coach and i think he sees what i see with the list so all that "you just hate Ross" stuff can be canned now.

I think hes the right guy and i think he sees the value that weve got.

Is the list complete dog shit? No
Is it a rebuild? No

Does Ross rate the entire list? Evidently not as he has gone full blown in backing the youth movement whilst simultaneously trying to bring in more experienced players like Shiel and Goldstein.

Happy to accept Gresham leaving if we got a first rounder.

Happy for Howard Paton Billings Coffield to go if we get adequate returns too.

It’s very evident from here, he thinks what we had is good not great. But that means middle of the ladder and not contending.

I personally think it’s a down year as for multiple reasons where we are is probably too far back to make finals.

But there is a silver lining and that has to be pick/s high enough to improve our plodding midfield.

Missing that area is the draft means it’s a wasted season.

 

[phantom13]

This is correct.

Is the list complete dog shit? No
Is it a rebuild? No

Does Ross rate the entire list? Evidently not as he has gone full blown in backing the youth movement whilst simultaneously trying to bring in more experienced players like Shiel and Goldstein.

Happy to accept Gresham leaving if we got a first rounder.

Happy for Howard Paton Billings Coffield to go if we get adequate returns too.

It’s very evident from here, he thinks what we had is good not great. But that means middle of the ladder and not contending.

I personally think it’s a down year as for multiple reasons where we are is probably too far back to make finals.

But there is a silver lining and that has to be pick/s high enough to improve our plodding midfield.

Missing that area is the draft means it’s a wasted season.

I doubt any coach rates their entire list and every player has a price to trade.

This "full blown youth movement" is fallacy. Hes playing guys on merit (possibly gifting Collard a few games because he was literally the only small forward available).

No Arie, No Keeler, Garcia and Hastie in and out and yes im aware 45 people are gonna say "Keeler isnt ready" etc etc. Its not the point, full blown youth policy means they get games regardless of that for the sake of blooding them.

Again, to be clear, i actually think that selection policy is fine, although if were not making finals i can see the harm in playing them and us losing but i also have no issue with selection being merit based either.

 

[stavro#4]

I doubt any coach rates their entire list and every player has a price to trade.

This "full blown youth movement" is fallacy. Hes playing guys on merit (possibly gifting Collard a few games because he was literally the only small forward available).

No Arie, No Keeler, Garcia and Hastie in and out and yes im aware 45 people are gonna say "Keeler isnt ready" etc etc. Its not the point, full blown youth policy means they get games regardless of that for the sake of blooding them.

Again, to be clear, i actually think that selection policy is fine, although if were not making finals i can see the harm in playing them and us losing but i also have no issue with selection being merit based either.

Full blown youth policy.

Suggest you review our games into u23s in the last 18 months vs the competition.

We got over 100 last year into Caminiti Pou Owens Windy NAS Byrnes.

Same group + collard Wilson Garcia Hastie and Henry.

I guarantee you that aligns with North and west coast etc. not the other end of the ladder.

 

[phantom13]

Full blown youth policy.

Suggest you review our games into u23s in the last 18 months vs the competition.

We got over 100 last year into Caminiti Pou Owens Windy NAS Byrnes.

Same group + collard Wilson Garcia Hastie and Henry.

I guarantee you that aligns with North and west coast etc. not the other end of the ladder.

Probably because we’ve had a cooked injury list for the first half of the season and no other available options.

Why the **** is Seb Ross getting games if we’re in a full blown youth policy? I’ll tell ya Stav, cause we’re not.

 

[StFly]

Probably because we’ve had a cooked injury list for the first half of the season and no other available options.

Why the **** is Seb Ross getting games if we’re in a full blown youth policy? I’ll tell ya Stav, cause we’re not.

Because you get North otherwise and kids running around being headless chooks so you need people around that know shit. That's why Seb exists these days having previously spent time forward, in defence, in mid, and he's also durable AF to be available to plug those sort of gaps in list.

So we get to last year, yes we played finals, we had no reason to really, as we got players back we started shitting the bed more often and fell over that line to get pantsed by a GWS that was launching.

This year has really hammered home "mid and F50" as the focus areas for improvement. Now you're not really going to get much when you turf from that area as they're shit, I mean, we're the ones omitting them and we have NFI what we're doing half the time. So you bleed from strength, aka the Battle & Howard talk, it's also why Membrey pops back in despite the game largely being past him pace wise.

Just also, Seb wouldn't really be given games if Crouch was free and clear for example, as they can do the same things in those thirds with Seb being a better defender type of the two, so it's still a rotation instance caused by injury, just not as severe.

 

[phantom13]

Because you get North otherwise and kids running around being headless chooks so you need people around that know shit. That's why Seb exists these days having previously spent time forward, in defence, in mid, and he's also durable AF to be available to plug those sort of gaps in list.

So we get to last year, yes we played finals, we had no reason to really, as we got players back we started shitting the bed more often and fell over that line to get pantsed by a GWS that was launching.

This year has really hammered home "mid and F50" as the focus areas for improvement. Now you're not really going to get much when you turf from that area as they're shit, I mean, we're the ones omitting them and we have NFI what we're doing half the time. So you bleed from strength, aka the Battle & Howard talk, it's also why Membrey pops back in despite the game largely being past him pace wise.

Just also, Seb wouldn't really be given games if Crouch was free and clear for example, as they can do the same things in those thirds with Seb being a better defender type of the two, so it's still a rotation instance caused by injury, just not as severe.

Also why some of the kids have been played (the injuries)
Anyway, not the point of the original post and CBF with it.

 

[Yawkey way]

Schoenmaker to debut so that’s another kid to add to the list.

 

[TheJackal]

We'd have got the mil in the cap back end of next year.

Yes and no, without paying it this year on Shiel, it enables us to bring some contract payments forward and use the mill from this year in the future.

 

[PoppedCorn]

HAWKS LINKS TO BATTLE GROW

Hawthorn are coming hard for St Kilda defender Josh Battle, who is an unrestricted free agent.

“Hawthorn is coming really hard; remember they missed their key defensive priorities last year? Ben McKay chose Essendon and Esava Ratugolea chose Port Adelaide,” Clark said.

“Now they’re setting their sights on Josh Battle.”

Ralph said he would be “worried” if he was the Saints and Clark said the club should try to retain his services.

“St Kilda desperately need to keep Josh Battle, he’s one of their most important players,” Clark said.

“He’s got good relationships at the Saints so it will be interesting to see how that plays out, they’re confident of keeping him in the red, white and black.”

Battle has averaged 17.6 disposals and 7.9 marks in 2024, continuing to shine as one of the game’s premier intercept defenders.

...and if he did support the hawks as a lad and the family are hawkers...why wouldn't you be looking at going
crazy not too

next minute...signs on with us lol

 

[StCicatriz]

...and if he did support the hawks as a lad and the family are hawkers...why wouldn't you be looking at going
crazy not too

next minute...signs on with us lol

i hope he does. until something changes i'm going to take the Misson on his word and have the opinion that he's close to signing.

 

[austinnn]

Schoenmaker to debut so that’s another kid to add to the list.

Arie getting the nod over Cordy tells me we are absolutely prioritising blooding the kids and development more than winning games this year, which suggests that we'd better get used to Josh Battle being another Hawthorn Grand Final hero who was once a Saint, unless he's willing to wait a little longer for success as a vet in a young team.

 

[austinnn]

i hope he does. until something changes i'm going to take the Misson on his word and have the opinion that he's close to signing.

...and then when it turns out that Misson was merely saying what any footy boss would say in that situation but Josh does in fact leave, you will scream "He lied to me!" and we can look forward to 6 more months of explosive "Misson/Lyon/Bassat Out" posts

 

[Gavinmitchell11]

At least Ross makes the Saints relevant, even though they’re unwatchable.
Have Not heard the Saints talked about so much since the last time he coached.

 

[kernelT]

Does Ross rate the entire list? Evidently not as he has gone full blown in backing the youth movement whilst simultaneously trying to bring in more experienced players like Shiel and Goldstein.

I hope this is a joke, because it would have been a putrid move to bring those two in. I am now more worried than I was earlier.

He hasn't had much choice but to play some younger guys this year, I doubt we'd have seen Garcia or Collard if Higgins and Butler were available more.

It's a relief to see Arie instead of Cordy this week… probably a good PR move given the state of our season.

 

[littlecreatures]

Im not a mod on the saints board so here i am just a regular poster.

Funny you seem me being disrespectful but none of the shit thrown my way is.

Last season was "magic" now, ffs.

Think applying magic was quite a fitting comment to your statement - “If people wanna say that last year was the abberation or whatever that’s fine but if Ross is the master coach why can’t he replicate it”.

 

[stavro#4]

I hope this is a joke, because it would have been a putrid move to bring those two in. I am now more worried than I was earlier.

He hasn't had much choice but to play some younger guys this year, I doubt we'd have seen Garcia or Collard if Higgins and Butler were available more.

It's a relief to see Arie instead of Cordy this week… probably a good PR move given the state of our season.

If we aren’t attracting star players then you need to support your kids and cover the list deficiencies in the short term.

That’s probably too much thinking on your behalf to understand that.

 

[PoppedCorn]

 

[phantom13]

If we aren’t attracting star players then you need to support your kids and cover the list deficiencies in the short term.

That’s probably too much thinking on your behalf to understand that.

But I’m the one being abrasive apparently.

 

[stavro#4]

But I’m the one being abrasive apparently.

You are