Analysis Hawthorn rebuild: are they tanking?

[Bradkli]

Hawks will surely have at least 3 million spare salary cap space even while paying some of Mitchell and O'Mearas contracts. Think they will throw big money at Jade Gresham

11

Jade Gresham

Age

27

Ht

177cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Fwd

Career

Season

Last 5

D

17.4

4star

K

10.2

4star

HB

7.2

4star

M

3.2

3star

T

2.7

4star

G

1.1

4star

D

17.5

4star

K

10.8

4star

HB

6.8

4star

M

2.1

2star

T

2.0

3star

G

0.5

4star

D

11.8

3star

K

6.0

3star

HB

5.8

4star

M

2.6

3star

T

3.4

5star

G

0.4

3star

and Darcy Parish

3

Darcy Parish

Age

27

Ht

180cm

Wt

81kg

Pos.

Mid

Career

Season

Last 5

D

20.4

5star

K

9.2

4star

HB

11.2

5star

M

3.2

3star

T

3.3

5star

CL

3.2

5star

D

16.6

4star

K

7.4

3star

HB

9.1

5star

M

1.4

2star

T

2.0

3star

CL

3.1

4star

D

22.2

5star

K

7.6

3star

HB

14.6

5star

M

3.2

4star

T

4.4

5star

CL

3.6

5star

next year.

We will have a massive amount of $$ which is all well and good however, you need to be able to attract the player to your club..we previously missed on the likes of Tom lynch, Stephen Coniglio, Dylan shiel (lucky).

That was when we were playing finals and had the games so called “greatest ever modern day coach”..we now have a young coach and a incredibly young list. I think Sam Mitchell is definitely the right man for the job, but he has the biggest job in football over the next two years.

Next years free agent crop is also average. A jade Gresham or Darcy parish isn’t fast tracking our rebuild. Nailing this year and next years drafts are far more important as we will finally have a top 3 pick in both drafts.

 

[Frank Grimes]

I don't think it's necessarily tanking unless if the coach or players deliberately go into game day with the actual aim to lose. Providing Mitchel and the young players go out with the intent to win the contest and the game despite the unlikelyhood of winning due to a young side then I don't think it's tanking.

I see it more of a development strategy, though somewhat of an outdated one. The idea of trading out most of the older players and bringing a bunch of young players while being on the bottom of the ladder for a few years as a result may have been a reasonably effective strategy in the 00's, but these days it's mostly about the strategy in managing contracts, free agency and exploiting whatever concession you can for the draft.

 

[living_in_syd]

Tanking for wemby

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Colour me shocked to see you having a negative opinion regarding the hawks. Didn’t you have a tweet surface recently?

It's not as if there has been anything positive to report about Hawthorn over the past 6 weeks is there ? Stop being so defensive, if not outright precious.

 

[Messenger]

Tanking for wemby

Stopping for Scoot

 

[The 747]

If they rate Mitchell so highly wonder why he got such a hospital handpass? They could have done this last year and had Clarko ride the bumps this year.

Mitchell couldn't wait though right?

 

[Sky]

Says the supporter of a team that contains a good portion of Premiership players and finished lower than us this year.

Yep. Hawks closer to a flag than West Coast. Until those overpaid premiership players are cleaned out, they are 2 years behind you and you’re arguably only ahead of two clubs currently. Saints the other.

Obviously brings me no joy to be complimenting Hawthorn!

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

If they rate Mitchell so highly wonder why he got such a hospital handpass? They could have done this last year and had Clarko ride the bumps this year.

Mitchell couldn't wait though right?

Clubs were not too sure about where Covid would take the competition and the underage comps in 2022 this time last year due to all the lockdowns. So there was a risk to trading out of that draft if the 2022 draft year got wiped like 2020.
This along with so many clubs having tight caps meant that not many clubs were open to trading for our players. Giants clearly were with Chad and Breust knocking back a move, but nothing much else moved passed initial conversations and enquiries.

Clubs have now had 12 months of scouting U16,U17 and U18 comps from across the country, so there’s a bit more confidence in what they can do with picks both this year and beyond.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

And if Hawthorn don't win a flag in the 2020's I can guarantee there will be no Hawthorn supporters

I would still be one, so you're talking shit.

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

The faux concern is touching, really. Im happy with the way Mitchell is going about it and so are most Hawks fans, thats what matters. I cant wait until next year, they have a really exciting young group that us Hawks fans will watch grow together for 10 years moving forward, as a supporter this is fun, reminds me of 2004.

I haven't wandered on to the main board for a while now, I can see why, just full of petty bullshit with occasional thoughtful discussion thrown in

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

Hawks will surely have at least 3 million spare salary cap space even while paying some of Mitchell and O'Mearas contracts. Think they will throw big money at Jade Gresham and Darcy Parish next year.

Im not so sure they will target those two and Im not sure those two would choose Hawthorn. Its a bit soon.

Hawks are another year or 2 off targeting those mid 20s established players. For the next 12-24 months it is about getting a few blokes to that 50-100 game mark and finding out who will be premiership players, along with using the draft.

Front load a bunch of contracts, lock away some young stars and then after a year or two - after a season or two of playing an exciting, fast brand with the right attitude - players will want to get involved with the club and they can start targeting FAs and OOC players.

They have a plan and they are sticking faithfully to it.

Oh, and just so I fit in, OP is just a sour little bitch.

 

[Elmer_Hauser]

Going by the poll results so far, the consensus is Hawthorn are doing the wrong thing and should be punished

 

[PrinceCharles]

It's okay to have differing opinions, but Amon has had a better past 24 months than Adam Cerra who your side paid a first round draft pick to acquire.
We got him for nothing via free agency and he adds something to our list that has been completely absent. A smooth moving midfielder capable of breaking lines with his kicking ability.

There is also a consensus that Lloyd Meek would have been a number 1 ruck if he wasn't stuck behind Sean Darcy. 8 clubs asked the question about him and he chose us.

Karl Amon is 4 years older than Cerra and Cerra plays inside and outside for the Blues, stats very similar in 2022 except Cerra with more clearances obviously.

Meek would have been number one if he wasn't stuck behind the number one ruck, right.

 

[PrinceCharles]

That must be the reason why hawthorn has to pay the poverty tax for which your club is a recipient.

Source?

 

[bergholt]

That must be the reason why hawthorn has to pay the poverty tax for which your club is a recipient.

Doesn't Hawthorn pay that tax because they suck money out of disadvantaged people with their pokies?

 

[evo]

NGL its pretty nice to see the Hawks floundering.

 

[nickrebellious]

The Hawks were told all year that O’meara and Tom Mitchell were no good, despite Sam already playing them off the bench or on the flanks a lot more, then he trades them out for younger players of need and people all of a sudden lose their mind that we traded away superstars and we’re tanking…

Case in point.

Then.



Now.

 

[STPer18]

Not sure if they're wheeling out the tank but I reckon they should be punished anyway just in case.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

David Noble. There’s your problem, the bloke couldn’t coach. You’re forgetting North got in that mess because they hired a young coach and then let him fall into a whole with no support until he was that mentally slammed that he had to quit.

All of North’s woes have zero relevance to Hawthorn.

I think they do. Sam Mitchell's had an encouraging start, nothing more than that. David Teague and Rhyce Shaw had encouraging starts.

I think it's certainly the right approach but there is a tinge of arrogance in it that Mitchell gets that couple of years' 'past champion' grace that typically wouldn't be afforded to outsiders. If Noble had played at North and had a career similar to Mitchell's, I'd bet he'd still be there, rightly or wrongly.

But that's where Mitchell is fortunate and it might be a good or a bad thing for Hawthorn. He gets a pass for next year and 2024 no matter what happens - Noble was gone by then. But I think it would take something extraordinary for him to get the arse before the end of 2026, which is good if he's the right man for the rebuild, not so good if he's not. We'll see.

 

[Toump Ass]

Yes please.

Punish them for racism.
Punish them for tanking.
Punish them for "bringing the game into disrepute".

Burn them with fire.

 

[Duskfire]

Aren't they just doing what North did a couple of years ago?

Tanking is different really. Its deliberately throwing games. I don't think Mitchell is going to approach matches with the mindset of "better lose this game oh yeah." He will be trying to win games as much as possible. It is good for culture and it is good for the players and he would understand this.

 

[Jim Prideaux]

It's not as if there has been anything positive to report about Hawthorn over the past 6 weeks is there ? Stop being so defensive, if not outright precious.

Lol, precious. I’m pretty happy with our trade period so far, hoping we can maximise our draft hand by packaging a few of our later picks.

You can hate Hawthorn all you want, just stay off twitter eh?

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I think they do. Sam Mitchell's had an encouraging start, nothing more than that. David Teague and Rhyce Shaw had encouraging starts.

I think it's certainly the right approach but there is a tinge of arrogance in it that Mitchell gets that couple of years' 'past champion' grace that typically wouldn't be afforded to outsiders. If Noble had played at North and had a career similar to Mitchell's, I'd bet he'd still be there, rightly or wrongly.

But that's where Mitchell is fortunate and it might be a good or a bad thing for Hawthorn. He gets a pass for next year and 2024 no matter what happens - Noble was gone by then. But I think it would take something extraordinary for him to get the arse before the end of 2026, which is good if he's the right man for the rebuild, not so good if he's not. We'll see.

There’s a tonne more stuff to reference in regards to North’s predicament and why they took on a guy who was not even a coach at the time that makes it completely different to the Hawthorn scenario, but I cant be bothered going into it in this thread. I assumed it was self explanatory why the two situations are different.

 

[MC Extra Dollop]

There’s a tonne more stuff to reference in regards to North’s predicament and why they took on a guy who was not even a coach at the time that makes it completely different to the Hawthorn scenario, but I cant be bothered going into it in this thread. I assumed it was self explanatory why the two situations are different.

Mitchell was fast tracked into the role in a similar manner to Nathan Buckley at Collingwood. The beauty of getting someone like Noble in is you can quickly turf him within 18 months if it isn't working. Much tougher to do with a club legend and I'm not sure Hawthorn would have moved heaven and earth to appoint Mitchell if he'd played his football elsewhere. So it's risky.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

Mitchell was fast tracked into the role in a similar manner to Nathan Buckley at Collingwood. The beauty of getting someone like Noble in is you can quickly turf him within 18 months if it isn't working. Much tougher to do with a club legend and I'm not sure Hawthorn would have moved heaven and earth to appoint Mitchell if he'd played his football elsewhere. So it's risky.

This still isn’t a good comparison. Mitchell was an assistant at the Eagles when they won a flag, he then returned to Hawthorn as a development coach, and then coached Box Hill and built such a connection with the players in that short time that it was the youngsters that he was coaching there who agitated for the Clarkson succession plan to be scuttled. Buckley was anointed on his club status, alone.