Review Positives and Negatives vs North

[Wosh]

I was unnaturally calm at quarter time despite being 20 points down and was convinced at half time we would win. Very unusual for me because I'm normally channelling my inner ep2006 during games

Continue to be amazed at the complete lack of football understanding some of our supporters in the crowd have

Me too, the kids were like OMG we're awful and I was very calm and confident we were going to brush of the nerves in the first quarter and North were going to falter as the game went on. The goal yips were scary again but the positive is we got them out of the way this game and not next week..we generally kick 20 behinds every few weeks because we just have so many shots at goal which is a good thing. We WILL convert in the GF.
Confident Hawthorn will bring out the absolute best footy in us.

Wellers having a blinder is a massive positive for his confidence going into next week.

 

[Biggie]

I was spitting chips at qtr time.

**** you two & your calm bullshit haha

 

[jeffsy]

Negative: Shuey and Gov interviews at the same time on different channels

Sent from my SM-G920I using Tapatalk

 

[Wosh]

I was spitting chips at qtr time.

**** you two & your calm bullshit haha

Mate there was NO way we were going to let North beat us at Subi, no way..I just kept chanting that till I fully believed it.
My BFF Tia Maria helped.

 

[ArdentEagle]

Wellers was better

Not for me, I have Kennedy just beating him too.

 

[HeaveHo_WeBlow]

+ives:

WE'RE IN A GRAND FINAL BABY!!!
Wellingham/JK presence was really really noticeable around the ground.
The Priddis goal was delicious.
The Sheed goal was even more delicious.
WE'RE IN A GRAND FINAL BABY!!!
I actually got to touch the game ball for the first time.
The guy beside me, maybe 30 years older than me with his son, the guy's leg was shaking the whole time in anxiety goes to show, no matter how old you are this wonderful game can give you a damn heart attack.
(If you're in Block 140 and read this forum, you're a great father mate )
WE'RE IN A GRAND FINAL BABY!!!
High fiving everyone in an Eagles Guernsey in the end.
WE BEAT NORTH MELBOURNE AND SAW BRAD SCOTT HAVE A WHINGE.
Good to see NN Smile and look as though he is enjoying his football again.

-ives.
The first quarter was horrid, I never want to see that crap again.
Yeo had an off night, but I'll look past it considering it would be his first bad night, his first final, and aslong as he learns from it.
NORTH MELBOURNE AREN'T IN A GRAND FINAL BABY!!!
Sparing a thought for EMAC and Brown who whilst will get to experience a Grand Final, they won't be playing in this one.
I'm not as young as I used to be, I'm nursing a mean hangover and still feeling woozy.

 

[Johnno22]

+GF BABY!!!
+Gutsy comeback after qtr time. That took real nerve both on the field and in the coaches box.
+We've just recently beaten Hawthorn. They'll be worried.
+There's no way we'll kick that badly in front of goal next week.

-Predictable whining about umps. Could've written this before the game.
-McGovern still severely hampered. Shanked kicks, dropped marks.
-Some sort of issue with NicNat. 64% TOG in a such a crucial game seems very odd.

I'm sure it was a tactic against Goldy to give both rucks equal time at him reducing his effectiveness in the last quarter.
Coaches held their nerve and it worked.

 

[Johnno22]

+
We have not lost a game at the MCG this year and the Hawks have lost three.

 

[ziad]

Negatives, Qtr time - I have already paid for flights.

Positives - the last three qtrs.

 

[ioppolo]

Found myself at the Crown Sports Bar watching this. The atmosphere was insane. Went right off that 3rd quarter. Sheppard's spoil on Ben Brown was greeted with huge cheers. Our 2006 team had better players (IMO) but this 2015 team is more likeable from a fan's point of view. The players seem more involved with the fans and fans respond well, Josh Hill running up and hugging 3 or 4 people despite copping flak from time to time is a great example.

 

[Teameagles]

Positives-

Kennedy's mark brought me to my feet, the courage then skill to finish made me believe after that start, what an absolute champion.

Luke shuey did what champion midfielders do when they are getting scragged and tagged, he made his big moments count, that juddesque goal was amazing.

Brad f$&king SHEPPARD! this boy killed contest after contest, kept his feet and held 90% of his marking opportunities, he could well take home Norm next week, AA back pocket for the next 5 years.

Will Schoefield was immense all night, his two on one contest in the last when he charged desperately at the footy to lock it up was inspirational, he's such a rock of our backline, needs to stich up roughy next week.

Wellingham/Lecras/ellis/priddis/sheed all kept us in it early, Wellinghams goal, priddis in and under, leccas disposal, shreds composure, Ellis stood up and showed his experience.

Negatives-

GOAL KICKING

NUMBERS AT THE CONTEST

But so happy right now, I was the angriest man in South Australia last night and next Saturday I'm actually afraid of what could go down.

EAGLES FOREVER FOREVER EAGLES

 

[Dugg]

Negative: I'm really ****ing hungover

 

[thekelvin]

+ves
-Wellingham was clearly best on ground.
-Sheppherd, Sheed and Priddis good
-Brad Scott was all class in his press conference (though this could be negative I wanted the meltdown)
-into a Grand final!

-ves
-I actually think Goldstein was quite a lot better than Naitanui, although maybe if Nic had kicked his goal from the boundary I wouldn't think so

 

[Schrodinger]

Just posted the following in the umpire rant thread on the North board, in case anyone is interested (or someone pops an artery and deletes it)

Hello everyone,

While I acknowledge that posting on an opposition supporters' post-game umpire venting thread will be as popular as a vegan at a paleo convention, I thought I might make a couple of points which, depending on the person, will either comfort or further enrage.

As someone with more than a passing interest in cognitive biases (I am lucky enough that a book I wrote on this topic allows me to spend far too much time lurking on BF), I have a macabre hobby of reading as many post-game threads (preferably non-West Coast games - see above point on cognitive bias) to read the various anti-umpire comments. Here are some general observations -

• I can't remember seeing a post-game (hereafter PG) thread without supporters complaining about calls that went against them (they must exist so will guess at least 95%)
• There is a near-perfect correlation between whether your team lost and how much of the discussion centres on umpiring
• In close games, these supporters will claim that the decisions "probably cost us the game"
• In games with margins beyond that which could be claimed to be influenced by umpiring alone, supporters will talk about calls early in the game, or when their team was fighting back as being "momentum killers"
• In games where a supporter's team loses the free kick count, the supporter points to the count without identifying the information which would make this stat meaningful - a) For each free, was it there or not? b) Once you have confirmed this, what happens when you add in the frees not paid to both sides. Once you have done this, you have "useful" data
• In games where the losing team's free count was equal to or higher than the winning team's, supporters will talk about "where the frees occurred" or when in the context of the game
• Teams who lose often give away silly frees out of panic (for example, I haven't looked at any stats however would hazard a guess that Nic Nat has received the most frees for the Eagles due to opposition trying to stop him from jumping) or because they are second to the ball
• When a supporter's team loses to West Coast, Hawthorn, Collingwood or Richmond, there will be talk of a conspiracy of some kind

And now some general points regarding biases in general -

• When someone becomes highly emotional, a part of their brain called the amygdala "hijacks" the part of your brain responsible for rational thought and decision making
• I would therefore expect to see more anti-umpire and conspiracy posts in finals (and further increase with each game closer to the GF)
• If you even just read the Wikipedia entry on cognitive biases, it makes for fascinating reading as you can see common examples from footy fans
• Just to give an example - notice how most people think they always seem to choose the slowest moving queue in Coles? This is because a slow queue makes as angry and a fast queue is never noticed. So we only ever remember the slow queues. How many times can you remember thinking "wow, we were really lucky today with umpiring" versus the times you thought the umps were favouring the other team?
• By the way, there is even a version of survivorship bias or selection bias with the creation of threads like these. If anyone here has had the misfortune of suffering depression and needing to take medication, you may have noticed that all you ever see on internet forums is people talking about how terrible "drug x" was. People whose depression has been successfully treated by this drug are rarely motivated to spend their days on depression forums. Same goes for supporters whose team has won the game or the free kick count.

I will make only one specific comment regarding last night. (Disclosure - I am an Eagles fan so this will be biased, not matter how hard I try - look up "bias blind spot" on the Wiki article). After watching Dockers/Hawks the night before, you may recall one of the commentators calling it a "whistle fest" at one point, with the umps getting trigger happy (that Ballantyne bump off the ball...wow...just wow). I thought the umps may have gotten a spray by their bosses who then may have warned last night's umps not to do the same. This was evident from the get-go last night, with the umps appearing to have decided to let it go more than usual. I saw dozens of frees each way that weren't paid.

What this means is that focusing on frees that weren't paid in isolation is meaningless. An unbiased observer would need to tally everything that was paid, which of these were actually frees or not, and then which ones were not paid. Then we at least have the beginnings of truly useful and interesting data. This cuts both ways mind you. I am more than prepared to accept that fans' complaints are justified, once I see the data presented as per above. And I am also prepared to accept that 43000 rabid Eagles supporters influence umpires' behaviour (they are human). However I have seen just the opposite apply, like the Eagles game against Collingwood earlier this year (for you "free kick count means everything" buffs, have a quick gander at the free count that day).

TLDR version - The venting in this thread may prove warranted, however the reasons posited are riddled with cognitive biases due to being formed in a highly emotional state.

 

[jesterwester]

I reckon a big positive will be the Hawks go in favourite next week. I don't think we handled the "hunted" tag so well, especially early.

We will be the clear underdogs, as we have been almost all year. It suits us perfectly.

Hopefully kicking with the red sherrin will improve our accuracy at goal.

 

[FatPizza]

I don't think too many people are questioning that overall we got the rub of the green last night. It's the connotation that we only won because of it that's offensive.

 

[HoneyBadger35]

Positive - our team doesn't have a single diver, ducker, stager, whinged or faux tough guy on the level of Waite. King of the knobs. Watching a replay now and I'm already sick of him, haven't even gotten to the good ones yet.

 

[Johnno22]

North Melbourne were never going to get the Umpiring decisions flowing their way when they are combating the Norf Dwarf trying to umpire the game for them.
Also just karma for the stunt he pulled on Priddis and the umps in Tassie.

You reap what you sow old man.

 

[Johnno22]

Positive - our team doesn't have a single diver, ducker, stager, whinged or faux tough guy on the level of Waite. King of the knobs. Watching a replay now and I'm already sick of him, haven't even gotten to the good ones yet.

Waite has always been the big tease, traditionally only plays one good game in four, then whinges and cry's in the other three.
Not a one tenth of the player his old man was.

 

[Luuuc]

Positives:
* The first quarter. Great wakeup call about finals intensity that will serve us well for the GF. Much much better to cop that this weekend than next weekend! We proved to ourselves that we can come back from a good run by the opposition.
* The big occasion. Lack of composure under real pressure, under perceived pressure, and under no pressure whatsoever other than the fact that this was a huge game, was costly in the first half. We adjusted in the second half, didn't panic as much, and played a lot better as a result. That lesson will serve us well.
* No major injuries.
* Lots of players below their best. Not good for last night, but good for the GF to have a number of players needing to make amends.

Negatives:
* Umpiring. Shockers like that in our favour have the potential to result in a backlash next round. Really not what we want in a grand final!
* Inaccuracy. It doesn't take much for the rot to set in, and it can cost you a premiership. Lots of sitters missed last night, by normally reliable kicks. This is my number one concern going into next Saturday.

 

[jesterwester]

Positive - our team doesn't have a single diver, ducker, stager, whinged or faux tough guy on the level of Waite. King of the knobs. Watching a replay now and I'm already sick of him, haven't even gotten to the good ones yet.

The player ratings agreed with your opinion of Jarrad "mr September" Waite.



Wellingham didn't rate as highly as I thought he would. But he was immense when the pressure was on, and we didn't score in the 1st qtr, so that does explain it a bit.

Also Kennedy is a gun. That is all.

 

[bUCKET__]

TLDR version - The venting in this thread may prove warranted, however the reasons posited are riddled with cognitive biases due to being formed in a highly emotional state.

conclusion could be phrased better needs moar outcome bias 8/10

 

[Magnum27]

Positives
Woke up this morning and it wasn't a dream. we are in the GF, and it feels bloody awesome

 

[mehow2g]

Another couple of random thoughts about the game.

+ve
One of the things Priddis does really well is to almost 'redirect defensive pressure' by staring at one option and the changing direction. An ability to get a defender just back onto his heals can release one of our players from congestion. His goal resulted from this when he appeared to be ready to handball... and when the defenders sagged off to the handball targets, he just kept it and wandered down to the shop for a cheeky sausage roll!!!!! Not sure if this is something Simmo has taught very well or if Priddis has always done it.

Not feeling hung over this morning. That is an absolute bonus.

-ve
I've always quite liked Swallow, but he spent a few times being the antagonist and then taking a massive dive fishing for a free kick. I think this was probably Norfs only hope, to suck us in and take advantage if we got undisciplined. I guess this can also be a positive, because we stuck to our systems and got the choccies.

Always said this about swallow, he,tends to fall on his stomach whenever he gets contact.

 

[lewigie]

Petrie decked Ellis off the ball and Schofield absolutely went off at him for a few minutes. Did that get much camera time at all?