Autopsy Round 18, 2024: Positives and Negatives vs Brisbane

[Dylan82]

Man Ryan could have had 4 goals and 20 touches. Epic game from him. Absolutely loving his move up the ground. that was initiated by Simpson so a big tick for the coaches in 2024

Ryan's form up the ground has certainly been an unexpected positive during another dumpster fire of a season.

But I wouldn't go so far as to celebrate it as a tactical masterstroke. He [Ryan] only went there in the last quarter against North because the Gaff/Sheed combination were having it handed to them by a side that had lost 31 of their last 32 matches and the "Land of the Giants" forward line left no other options that could provide a burst around stoppage.

That the move worked out so well seemed to be of surprise to the coaches as much as everyone else.

At least they learned from it as Ryan has been having productive bursts onball ever since.


Perhaps more good luck than good planning, but we'll take any positive we can at the moment.

 

[Priddis Is Done]

Gibney has the athletic profile but I’m not sure he has the football profile.
He doesn’t have clean hands, he just doesn’t have that natural feel for the bounce.
He hesitates in attacking the ball/contest, not from fear but just not sure of his place in the footy jigsaw.
I think going to HB is ideal as he can just run forward and as a defender he knows he has to go hard and fast and not think to much! He has the profile/attitude to succeed. Least of our worries at the moment

Cool. So we gave up pick 2 to grab a non natural half bank flanker.

It's one of the reasons all the department key staff have been booted out.

 

[THE A5]

Ryan's form up the ground has certainly been an unexpected positive during another dumpster fire of a season.

But I wouldn't go so far as to celebrate it as a tactical masterstroke. He [Ryan] only went there in the last quarter against North because the Gaff/Sheed combination were having it handed to them by a side that had lost 31 of their last 32 matches and the "Land of the Giants" forward line left no other options that could provide a burst around stoppage.

That the move worked out so well seemed to be of surprise to the coaches as much as everyone else.

At least they learned from it as Ryan has been having productive bursts onball ever since.


Perhaps more good luck than good planning, but we'll take any positive we can at the moment.

Ryan is what we hoped Petch would be but petch lacks all of Ryans footy smarts. Ryan would be such a weapon if our midfield unit was actually so strong. Offensively he’s so good but his direct opponent can hurt us the other way as well

 

[Cuzz09]

sTrewth

If Trew becomes a locked in best 22 in the future someone in the cheer squad should make a big banner of this!

Sent from my SM-S908E using BigFooty.com mobile app

 

[eaglesnutcase]

Cool. So we gave up pick 2 to grab a non natural half bank flanker.

It's one of the reasons all the department key staff have been booted out.

I certainly wouldn’t have taken him with my first pick.
That said he may well turn out to be a fine player.Brad Shepherd is always the first to spring to mind when looking at this situation.With hindsight I’d take Shepherd at P3.

 

[Keys]

I didn’t mind Ginbey off half back. Seems like something worth persevering with for the rest of the season at least

He could do with a dose of angry pills though at times. It’s far too pleasant a young man at the moment, needs a bit of mongrel. And he’s not the only one in the side right now

 

[Dylan82]

Cool. So we gave up pick 2 to grab a non natural half bank flanker.

It's one of the reasons all the department key staff have been booted out.

The club exchanged pick 2 to acquire the two best home-grown prospects in the draft to mitigate the significant and outspoken flight risks among talent that year.

Three year contracts for first round selections only came in from 2023 - the likes of Wardlaw, Sheezle and Phillipou would have been up for contract now had they been selected, and considering the disaster of the past two years it's likely they would be looking for an exit.

With the clock ticking before Tasmania compromises the draft, such an outcome would have been calamitous to the rebuild and placed continuous question marks over its cohesion and ability to retain talent. Compensation via the trade table would likely result in lesser value coming back for draft reinvestment as well.


Ginbey and Hewett provide a dependable foundation to the rebuild with near zero risk of departure, which enables the club to be more aggressive with talent acquisition in subsequent years.


If the 2022 pick split at 2 doesn't happen, West Coast probably play overly safe in 2023, splitting pick 1 and missing out on H.Reid.



How would you rather it have played out?

 

[Smotie2]

What's all the ginbey hate for?

Young player 19 years old averaging 15 disposals and 3 marks a game is doing fine imo.

ESPECIALLY in our basket case of a team with little to no support.

 

[eaglesnutcase]

What's all the ginbey hate for?

Young player 19 years old averaging 15 disposals and 3 marks a game is doing fine imo.

ESPECIALLY in our basket case of a team with little to no support.

Certainly not hate.That’s unnecessarily harsh.when the pick was split do you think Gibney was assessed on football ability? Athletic profile? Potential? State origin, or a bit of everything?
Hewett would be picked primarily on football talent.
I would have picked Hewett before Ginbey.( mind you that may not work out too well )
We all want both to succeed.
The discussion comes about by how we can make that happen.
Daicos,Sheezel started at HB.
There’s no stigma attached to playing back because your a high draft pick

 

[Ambrose Burnside]

Ginbey and Hewett provide a dependable foundation to the rebuild with near zero risk of departure, which enables the club to be more aggressive with talent acquisition in subsequent years.

I wouldn't call Hewett's feet a dependable foundation.

 

[Smotie2]

Certainly not hate.That’s unnecessarily harsh.when the pick was split do you think Gibney was assessed on football ability? Athletic profile? Potential? State origin, or a bit of everything?
Hewett would be picked primarily on football talent.
I would have picked Hewett before Ginbey.( mind you that may not work out too well )
We all want both to succeed.
The discussion comes about by how we can make that happen.
Daicos,Sheezel started at HB.
There’s no stigma attached to playing back because your a high draft pick

Not sure really.

I assume they draft on football ability but I'm seeing more and more that's not really the case.
I heard they drafted koutifidies on athleticism and it worked out for them but didn't know how often they do that.

 

[Dark Sharks]

Ginbey is rated as the sixth best player in the AFL in the 19-20 age bracket. The expectations on young players on here is tragic. Why destroy his confidence by dropping him when he is developing well.

I hardly call Ginbey going back to the WAFL for a stint "destroying his confidence". Jesus.

How have players ever made it at the top level previously after being dropped, that's outrageous


I'd point to Philipou a recent success story of a highly rated young player being dropped, going and building form in the VFL to the point he was dominating, and then coming back to AFL and bringing that form with him. Where does he sit on your little player ratings system you constantly throw around?

Philipou's last 2 at AFL level have easily been the best of his career, on the back of him being dropped.

Round 18: 20D, 15 contested, 9 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 101 ranking points.
Round 17: 25D, 6 contested, 5 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 112 ranking points.


Not that i think it's going to happen, but it won't be the end of the world if Ginbey builds some confidence and touch as a midfielder in the WAFL, like Chesser is doing. Just like getting Chesser off that gimp wing was important, letting Rueben settle in a full time mid that attends CB's might be better for him than playing him off a wing or half back.



"Destryoying confidence" is more akin to what Simpson has done with Trew. By leaving him in the WAFL despite being our best performing player for a long period, then giving him a quarter at AFL as the sub, then dropping him immediately back to the WAFL. He didn't do this once either, but several times.

 

[Flarn Rarn]

I hardly call Ginbey going back to the WAFL for a stint "destroying his confidence". Jesus.

How have players ever made it at the top level previously after being dropped, that's outrageous


I'd point to Philipou a recent success story of a highly rated young player being dropped, going and building form in the VFL to the point he was dominating, and then coming back to AFL and bringing that form with him. Where does he sit on your little player ratings system you constantly throw around?

Philipou's last 2 at AFL level have easily been the best of his career, on the back of him being dropped.

Round 18: 20D, 15 contested, 9 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 101 ranking points.
Round 17: 25D, 6 contested, 5 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 112 ranking points.


Not that i think it's going to happen, but it won't be the end of the world if Ginbey builds some confidence and touch as a midfielder in the WAFL, like Chesser is doing. Just like getting Chesser off that gimp wing was important, letting Rueben settle in a full time mid that attends CB's might be better for him than playing him off a wing or half back.



"Destryoying confidence" is more akin to what Simpson has done with Trew. By leaving him in the WAFL despite being our best performing player for a long period, then giving him a quarter at AFL as the sub, then dropping him immediately back to the WAFL. He didn't do this once either, but several times.

Also, at the other end of the spectrum, look at Gaff and Darling. Both dropped to the WAFL as senior players and took it well. If the old blokes can cop it the young ones certainly can too. It's not a referendum on your career to get dropped. Ask Will Schofield (just kidding, you don't need to ask - he'll tell you).

 

[Grahame]

I hardly call Ginbey going back to the WAFL for a stint "destroying his confidence". Jesus.

How have players ever made it at the top level previously after being dropped, that's outrageous


I'd point to Philipou a recent success story of a highly rated young player being dropped, going and building form in the VFL to the point he was dominating, and then coming back to AFL and bringing that form with him. Where does he sit on your little player ratings system you constantly throw around?

Philipou's last 2 at AFL level have easily been the best of his career, on the back of him being dropped.

Round 18: 20D, 15 contested, 9 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 101 ranking points.
Round 17: 25D, 6 contested, 5 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 112 ranking points.


Not that i think it's going to happen, but it won't be the end of the world if Ginbey builds some confidence and touch as a midfielder in the WAFL, like Chesser is doing. Just like getting Chesser off that gimp wing was important, letting Rueben settle in a full time mid that attends CB's might be better for him than playing him off a wing or half back.



"Destryoying confidence" is more akin to what Simpson has done with Trew. By leaving him in the WAFL despite being our best performing player for a long period, then giving him a quarter at AFL as the sub, then dropping him immediately back to the WAFL. He didn't do this once either, but several times.

I think if the Beagles were more competitive then fringe or young players could flick between the two without it being a big deal (to try a new possie or to gain some confidence).

So I’m not sure we can really know how good our Beagles players might be if they’re getting flogged each week.

And if they’re getting flogged each week there’s not much point putting a developing Eagles player back there.

To that end I’d be thinking at a minimum Darling, Gaff, Sheed play ressies plus some/all of Rotham, JJ, Witho, Petro and Flynn/BWill. Give the Beagles a boost while opening spots for fringe players.

Rebuilding includes exploring options.

 

[amazingjoshy]

Round 18: 20D, 15 contested, 9 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 101 ranking points.
Round 17: 25D, 6 contested, 5 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 112 ranking points.

I realise it wasn't the point of your post, but some people have been using Phillipous last 2 (his best 2 of his career by far) as some sort of example that we made a mistake taking Ginbey ahead of him

Rd 10 Ginbey had 21d (11 contested), 3 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goals and a DE of 76%

Rd 12 he had 20d (12 contested), 8 tackles, 6 clearances, 5 makes and a DE of 80%

He also had 3 or 4 comparable games (probably when given the chance in his role) in his first year too.The WC board group think is missing the mark on this one imo. He's a kid tracking just fine

 

[Hoskin300]

I hardly call Ginbey going back to the WAFL for a stint "destroying his confidence". Jesus.

How have players ever made it at the top level previously after being dropped, that's outrageous


I'd point to Philipou a recent success story of a highly rated young player being dropped, going and building form in the VFL to the point he was dominating, and then coming back to AFL and bringing that form with him. Where does he sit on your little player ratings system you constantly throw around?

Philipou's last 2 at AFL level have easily been the best of his career, on the back of him being dropped.

Round 18: 20D, 15 contested, 9 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 101 ranking points.
Round 17: 25D, 6 contested, 5 tackles, 5 clearances, 1 goal and 112 ranking points.


Not that i think it's going to happen, but it won't be the end of the world if Ginbey builds some confidence and touch as a midfielder in the WAFL, like Chesser is doing. Just like getting Chesser off that gimp wing was important, letting Rueben settle in a full time mid that attends CB's might be better for him than playing him off a wing or half back.



"Destryoying confidence" is more akin to what Simpson has done with Trew. By leaving him in the WAFL despite being our best performing player for a long period, then giving him a quarter at AFL as the sub, then dropping him immediately back to the WAFL. He didn't do this once either, but several times.

Philipou was genuinely terrible at AFL level prior to being dropped. He was playing at like a quarter of the level ginbey was.

It’s a poor comparison because he genuinely deserved to be dropped. He can’t complain if he was by far the worst player in the team.

I would be pretty pissed off if I was ginbey getting dropped ahead of multiple senior guys performing at a worse level. Can’t just drop players when they are performing for the sake of ‘development’.

I agree regarding trew.

 

[Hoskin300]

I realise it wasn't the point of your post, but some people have been using Phillipous last 2 (his best 2 of his career by far) as some sort of example that we made a mistake taking Ginbey ahead of him

Rd 10 Ginbey had 21d (11 contested), 3 tackles, 6 clearances, 1 goals and a DE of 76%

Rd 12 he had 20d (12 contested), 8 tackles, 6 clearances, 5 makes and a DE of 80%

He also had 3 or 4 comparable games (probably when given the chance in his role) in his first year too.The WC board group think is missing the mark on this one imo. He's a kid tracking just fine

Yeah talking about Ginbeys position in our team should be the last thing on everyone’s mind.

 

[KERRPOW]

Petch up for selection. Doesn't deserve selection.
Only seven games in the season we can't risk bringing in players that haven't earned it through the wafl level when we have players knocking at the door

But he runs fast

 

[Doashuey]

I certainly wouldn’t have taken him with my first pick.
That said he may well turn out to be a fine player.Brad Shepherd is always the first to spring to mind when looking at this situation.With hindsight I’d take Shepherd at P3.

Yeah, I don't know. That Martin guy at 3 was fairly handy.

 

[Mulldogg]

Don’t think we’re at the stage of the season where we should be rushing Petch straight back into the senior side when there were performers like Dewar and Burgiel in the WAFL side last week. Underdone players coming back from injury should be going through the seconds. He’s not exactly a superstar.

Realise that the WAFL bye complicates things but he can do a big match sim session this weekend with the remainder of the Beagles and then play against Subi the following week with a view to coming in for the Friday night game against Gold Coast.

 

[eaglesnutcase]

Yeah, I don't know. That Martin guy at 3 was fairly handy.

Was actually looking at like for like situations

 

[Priddis Is Done]

The club exchanged pick 2 to acquire the two best home-grown prospects in the draft to mitigate the significant and outspoken flight risks among talent that year.

Three year contracts for first round selections only came in from 2023 - the likes of Wardlaw, Sheezle and Phillipou would have been up for contract now had they been selected, and considering the disaster of the past two years it's likely they would be looking for an exit.

With the clock ticking before Tasmania compromises the draft, such an outcome would have been calamitous to the rebuild and placed continuous question marks over its cohesion and ability to retain talent. Compensation via the trade table would likely result in lesser value coming back for draft reinvestment as well.


Ginbey and Hewett provide a dependable foundation to the rebuild with near zero risk of departure, which enables the club to be more aggressive with talent acquisition in subsequent years.


If the 2022 pick split at 2 doesn't happen, West Coast probably play overly safe in 2023, splitting pick 1 and missing out on H.Reid.



How would you rather it have played out?

Thanks Dylan. Sheezel was a no go. I get that. If we backed ourselves in, it was Warlord.

Then from there it wad Phiipou. And there were many on here that were very disappointed in not taking him.

Ginbey was a complete left field hail Mary.