What They're Saying - The Bulldogs Media Thread - Part 4

[LittleG]

Nor should they be sat at a desk for 8 hours a day

Death by inactivity is a horrible way to go.

 

[inflames1919]

As someone who has suffered multiple concussions as well as post concussion syndrome I don’t blame Liam at all for going down this path.

I actually reached out to Liam years back after going through a difficult period due to my post concussive symptoms and he was a big help in giving me some advice as well as sharing his recovery story.

Post concussive symptoms are incredibly complex to treat and can be misunderstood by doctors and specialists. Each case is unique and symptoms can vary from person to person. Unfortunately the only way to completely understand it is to actually experience it - which I wouldn’t wish on anyone.


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[Libbaaaa]

I think you’ll find most clubs have cases like this, you can’t take it personally that Liam just wants answers. Jordan Lewis

Jordan Lewis

Age

38

Ht

186cm

Wt

86kg

Pos.

D/M

Career

Season

Last 5

D

23.5

5star

K

12.1

4star

HB

11.5

5star

M

5.5

5star

T

2.7

4star

MG

310.5

4star

No current season stats available

D

15.0

4star

K

6.8

3star

HB

8.2

5star

M

4.8

5star

T

2.8

5star

came back to play the same day when Harbrow knocked him out, and the week after, game was a completely different place back then.

 

[Dogman 1]

I think the players have to take some of the blame. They go into this sport knowing that they could receive head knocks and concussions happen. It is their choice to participate. Before long players will have to sign waivers to exclude themselves from suing.

 

[Bald]

I think the players have to take some of the blame. They go into this sport knowing that they could receive head knocks and concussions happen. It is their choice to participate. Before long players will have to sign waivers to exclude themselves from suing.

First of all, I think you're mostly right. They should take some of the responsibility for what they put their bodies through, but I also think if what has been said is true and he was either not informed as extensively as he should have been, or he was put into situations he shouldn't have been, then for those things he should take no blame or responsibility for.

I also think any legal concerns former players have should be taken out on the AFL as a general rule, as opposed to the clubs, which I know sounds like I'm being biased and have my tinted glasses on, but ultimately the AFL should be setting the directive to the clubs on how to manage concussions.

 

[Sentinel]

First of all, I think you're mostly right. They should take some of the responsibility for what they put their bodies through, but I also think if what has been said is true and he was either not informed as extensively as he should have been, or he was put into situations he shouldn't have been, then for those things he should take no blame or responsibility for.

I also think any legal concerns former players have should be taken out on the AFL as a general rule, as opposed to the clubs, which I know sounds like I'm being biased and have my tinted glasses on, but ultimately the AFL should be setting the directive to the clubs on how to manage concussions.

On your second point, I think liability should come down to AFL protocols (which should be league wide) vs how an individual club is enforcing them. The AFL needs to have appropriate measures in place to mitigate the issues as much as possible, and the clubs equally need to ensure they are adhered to (whilst also being overseen by the league).

 

[Foxman98]

First of all, I think you're mostly right. They should take some of the responsibility for what they put their bodies through, but I also think if what has been said is true and he was either not informed as extensively as he should have been, or he was put into situations he shouldn't have been, then for those things he should take no blame or responsibility for.

I also think any legal concerns former players have should be taken out on the AFL as a general rule, as opposed to the clubs, which I know sounds like I'm being biased and have my tinted glasses on, but ultimately the AFL should be setting the directive to the clubs on how to manage concussions.

The AFL is an employer and the players are their employees, It is up to the workplace to have policies and procedures in place to help protect their employees. Given we've only had some "action" withing the last 3 years and not when Picken was playing it's safe to assume he was put in situations he shouldn't have been and anyone trying to attack him here is nothing short of a moron.

Yes players know the risks of playing a contact sport as a profession as do forklift drivers/warehouse employees who also get payouts when injured at their workplace.

Some here need to stop acting as if Picken is trying to dismantle the club and derail our season and understand he now has a lifelong struggle and injury due to what happened at his workplace and given their understanding of the situation medically they were very negligent at best in their response.

 

[King Harold]

I think the players have to take some of the blame. They go into this sport knowing that they could receive head knocks and concussions happen. It is their choice to participate. Before long players will have to sign waivers to exclude themselves from suing.

The main point seems lost on you.
It is alleged the Club \ Doctors did not inform Liam ,testing had him failing thresholds and sent him back to playing on.

If proven , that is not acceptable under any circumstances.

 

[Foxman98]

The main point seems lost on you.
It is alleged the Club \ Doctors did not inform Liam ,testing had him failing thresholds and sent him back to playing on.

If proven , that is not acceptable under any circumstances.

The other point being missed is it is their workplace, We are all entitled to compensation to any injuries that we receive at our workplace AFL players are no different

 

[Dogs_r_barking]

I just feel for Liam and the impact this is having on his family. He is suffering from “irritability, anxiety, depression and stress“and not able to concentrate.

 

[doggies ftw]

Some here need to stop acting as if Picken is trying to dismantle the club and derail our season and understand he now has a lifelong struggle and injury due to what happened at his workplace and given their understanding of the situation medically they were very negligent at best in their response.

Should that be the case then absolutely he’s entitled to compensation and I’d hope he gets looked after.

These allegations directly at our medical staff go wayyyyyy past negligence, you’d hope there’s merit to the claims is all I’m saying

 

[Sentinel]

Some here need to stop acting as if Picken is trying to dismantle the club and derail our season and understand he now has a lifelong struggle and injury due to what happened at his workplace and given their understanding of the situation medically they were very negligent at best in their response.

I don't think that's fair to say at this point. It may be proven to be the case, and appears to be part of the case which Picken is bringing against the club, but it's yet to be tested.

 

[Foxman98]

Should that be the case then absolutely he’s entitled to compensation and I’d hope he gets looked after.

These allegations directly at our medical staff go wayyyyyy past negligence, you’d hope there’s merit to the claims is all I’m saying

He should be entitled to compensation regardless, He sustained these lifelong injuries performing his job at his place of work, the only thing the negligence does is provide how much he is entitled to not if he should be.

 

[Foxman98]

I don't think that's fair to say at this point. It may be proven to be the case, and appears to be part of the case which Picken is bringing against the club, but it's yet to be tested.

If they have the documents which one would say its safe to assume they do given they are using it in their legal case then one can confidently say the medical team were being negligent at best

 

[Sentinel]

If they have the documents which one would say its safe to assume they do given they are using it in their legal case then one can confidently say the medical team were being negligent at best

'If' being the operative word. I'm not picking sides (if you want to call them that) either way, just saying that there's a process to play out here before we jump to any conclusions of wrongdoing.

Obviously any evidence of negligence, if it exists, should form part of the case against the relevant partie/s.

 

[doggies ftw]

He should be entitled to compensation regardless, He sustained these lifelong injuries performing his job at his place of work, the only thing the negligence does is provide how much he is entitled to not if he should be.

Yeah that’s definitely not how these things work unfortunately

 

[maddog37]

Shithouse outcome for all involved.

Feel really sorry for Liam who is such a great fella.

 

[immortalmike]

Have some sympathy for the opinion that contact sports are entered into willingly and some level of damage is to be expected.
However, Liam and his legal team seem to be alleging negligence. That is unacceptable.
Terrible situation all round. Not sure how to feel to be honest. Oscillating from hoping it's not true and wanting Liam to receive compensation.

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

As someone who has suffered multiple concussions as well as post concussion syndrome I don’t blame Liam at all for going down this path.

I actually reached out to Liam years back after going through a difficult period due to my post concussive symptoms and he was a big help in giving me some advice as well as sharing his recovery story.

Post concussive symptoms are incredibly complex to treat and can be misunderstood by doctors and specialists. Each case is unique and symptoms can vary from person to person. Unfortunately the only way to completely understand it is to actually experience it - which I wouldn’t wish on anyone.


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I'm sorry to hear you've gone through that mate. I've worked with people going through the same thing and it is truly life-altering in ways that are really impossible for the general public to understand. Ironically the stigma from the public makes it worse - it is not easy going around with neurological/cognitive symptoms that are being constantly disregarded, sometimes even by health professionals, because the knowledge base just isn't there.

I hope things are better for you now. Unfortunately the care/medical treatment is nowhere near as available as it needs to be right now.

If anybody here does go through this at any point, or knows somebody that is going through it without support, please PM me. I can point you in the right direction. There are actually some amazing trials running at the moment that give you quality evidence-based care free of charge.

 

[Bulldogs85]

Their are always two sides of the story club doctors Gary Zimmerman and Jacob Landsberger will have their day in court.

 

[Foxman98]

Yeah that’s definitely not how these things work unfortunately

You really have no understanding of workplace health and safety and liability do you.

The AFL is the employer the same as any other company. He was injured performing his duties at his workplace and is still suffering from said injuries and is unable to work because of them.

I suggest you go and talk to the safety leader at your place of work and ask them the responsibilities of your employer for any injuries you sustain at work

 

[Bulldogs85]

You really have no understanding of workplace health and safety and liability do you.

The AFL is the employer the same as any other company. He was injured performing his duties at his workplace and is still suffering from said injuries and is unable to work because of them.

I suggest you go and talk to the safety leader at your place of work and ask them the responsibilities of your employer for any injuries you sustain at work

It’s a contact sport those injuries happen unfortunately

 

[Foxman98]

'If' being the operative word. I'm not picking sides (if you want to call them that) either way, just saying that there's a process to play out here before we jump to any conclusions of wrongdoing.

Obviously any evidence of negligence, if it exists, should form part of the case against the relevant partie/s.

The evidence is clear here, His brain scans were showing irregularities which by the rules today would have him away from training the club docters at the time didn't recommend this

 

[Foxman98]

It’s a contact sport those injuries happen unfortunately

And someone running over your foot with a forklift is something that happens frequently in warehouses doesn't mean the companies aren't liable for the injury.

Again for those struggling to understand this is an injury he got from performing his expected tasks at his workplace just because it is a sport doesn't mean they aren't held to the same safety standards and liabilities as any other workplace

 

[Dannnnnnnnnn]

The evidence is clear here, His brain scans were showing irregularities which by the rules today would have him away from training the club docters at the time didn't recommend this

You don't know any of this information. Stop pretending you do. "Brain scans showing irregularities" is not typical for concussion and there was no mention of anything of the sort in the article (which may not all be true anyway).