Analysis Hawthorn rebuild: are they tanking?

[matey]

You might not be concerned with DGB but I’m sure Mitchell and the club would be worried at this stage.
It’s tough in rebuild when high first round draft picks amount to nothing.
Dingley now a major issue for the club, having recently lost the project management and the club still searching for a CEO.
Surely the hawks wouldn’t tumble into Simon Lethlean would they …

You keep harping on about DGB as a pick nu 6. Would you be happy if you got Newk at 6? We got him for peanuts! Let’s see who ends up the better and more successful player between him or Walsh. And by the way we didn’t lose by tanking yesterday.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

You might not be concerned with DGB but I’m sure Mitchell and the club would be worried at this stage.
It’s tough in rebuild when high first round draft picks amount to nothing.
Dingley now a major issue for the club, having recently lost the project management and the club still searching for a CEO.
Surely the hawks wouldn’t tumble into Simon Lethlean would they …

I really don’t think Sam or the club are concerned by DGB. He either develops or he doesn’t. He’s just 1 player.

Dingley will only be considered an issue when there is some actual verified news declaring so, rather than assumptions and predictions on the basis of someone being poached.

 

[Red Bull]

Completely disagree a lot of kids have shown plenty and after seeing plenty of success over the years and what was leading up to it ……. something special is brewing at Hawthorn under Sam mark my words

I assure you, past glories count for nothing in these kind of rebuilds.
I admire Mitchell for taking up the challenge though and watch with interest as the rebuild grinds on …

 

[matey]

I assure you, past glories count for nothing in these kind of rebuilds.
I admire Mitchell for taking up the challenge though and watch with interest as the rebuild grinds on …

So Hawthorns future glories depends on whether DGB becomes a player or not!

 

[kriles76]

Then why the need for hawthorn to pump over 100 million into an old tip site ?
SYL has correctly pointed out that this thread isn’t about Carlton … or any other club.
There’s more than enough to discuss here relating to the hawks rebuild …

Au contaire.

Learning from the decades of mediocrity and shambolic administration of other clubs can provide useful learnings in what to avoid.

“It’s good to learn from your mistakes. It’s better to learn from other people’s mistakes.”

— Warren Buffett

 

[Red Bull]

I really don’t think Sam or the club are concerned by DGB. He either develops or he doesn’t. He’s just 1 player.

Dingley will only be considered an issue when there is some actual verified news declaring so, rather than assumptions and predictions on the basis of someone being poached.

This won’t help in addressing the issues re Dingley …

 

[Blackhawk42]

You might not be concerned with DGB but I’m sure Mitchell and the club would be worried at this stage.
It’s tough in rebuild when high first round draft picks amount to nothing.
Dingley now a major issue for the club, having recently lost the project management and the club still searching for a CEO.
Surely the hawks wouldn’t tumble into Simon Lethlean would they …

It's pretty easy to simply pretend we took Jai Newcombe at pick 6 in the 2020 draft anyway.

 

[hawkman]

You might not be concerned with DGB but I’m sure Mitchell and the club would be worried at this stage.
It’s tough in rebuild when high first round draft picks amount to nothing.
Dingley now a major issue for the club, having recently lost the project management and the club still searching for a CEO.
Surely the hawks wouldn’t tumble into Simon Lethlean would they …

Most of the 2020 draft looks poor with only a few real standouts. Covid seems to have impacted that draft greatly. Even then we look to have a couple of decent players out of it

 

[peetoo]

Au contaire.

Learning from the decades of mediocrity and shambolic administration of other clubs can provide useful learnings in what to avoid.

A key thing is not cutting into another rebuild too quickly. Eg not letting a coach even get two full seasons like a couple of clubs recently

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

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This won’t help in addressing the issues re Dingley …

Should I teleport into the board meetings you think?

I won’t be concerning myself with anything that I have no impact on.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

It's pretty easy to simply pretend we took Jai Newcombe at pick 6 in the 2020 draft anyway.

Yeah, and then you look at Seamus, Brocky and we nailed it.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

I’ve always valued Kane.

 

[Red Bull]

Should I teleport into the board meetings you think?

I won’t be concerning myself with anything that I have no impact on.

It must be disappointing for you that something you trumpeted as central to the rebuild is now a major concern for the club.
When a new CEO is finally appointed, they can get down to the task of finding a new project manager for Dingley and see what can be salvaged there along with sorting out the AFLW concerns with Box Hill oval.
Then there’s the ongoing racism investigation and possible HRC involvement to navigate.
Lethlean’s issues with Lyon might suddenly seem trivial in comparison to rebuilding the hawks both on and off the field …

 

[Mr Meeseeks]

rent free

 

[Ashman23]

Just shoring up our grasp on pick three.

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

It must be disappointing for you that something you trumpeted as central to the rebuild is now a major concern for the club.

No, it doesn't worry me at all, because we're a stand along club who will just work through whatever issues and come out the other side.
That's what we do.

When a new CEO is finally appointed, they can get down to the task of finding a new project manager for Dingley and see what can be salvaged there along with sorting out the AFLW concerns with Box Hill oval.

We have a stand in CEO, who by all reports is doing just fine. Box Hill is getting an upgrade, so not sure why that's such a 'concern'.

Then there’s the ongoing racism investigation and possible HRC involvement to navigate.
Lethlean’s issues with Lyon might suddenly seem trivial in comparison to rebuilding the hawks both on and off the field …

Again with the racism investigation that's gone nowhere. Ooga booga.
Lethlean doesn't work for Hawthorn, so it just looks desperate that you keep wanting to reference him.

 

[Roby]

DGB subbed out statless at half time in another capitulation yesterday.
To be dropped for a fourth time this season would no doubt be a real concern for Mitchell who would have been hoping the sixth draft pick in his third season would be a cornerstone in the club’s rebuild …

What a seriously stupid bump

 

[Red Bull]

What a seriously stupid bump

Would have thought the return on investment for the hawks and their highest rated draft pick in this rebuild would be considered a very serious matter by Mitchell and the club …

 

[Blackhawk42]

Would have thought the return on investment for the hawks and their highest rated draft pick in this rebuild would be considered a very serious matter by Mitchell and the club …

Drafted an elite mid in the mid season rookie draft 8 months later.
Just another Hawthorn drafting success story.

 

[Red Bull]

Drafted an elite mid in the mid season rookie draft 8 months later.
Just another Hawthorn drafting success story.

A good get no doubt and may well be the hawks best mid.
Where he rates AFL wide would be an interesting debate.
Perhaps a topic for the main board …

 

[Strapping Young Lad]

A good get no doubt and may well be the hawks best mid.
Where he rates AFL wide would be an interesting debate.
Perhaps a topic for the main board …

Top 20 in AFL coaches votes, Top 20 in the AFL ratings(CD).

 

[Blackhawk42]

A good get no doubt and may well be the hawks best mid.
Where he rates AFL wide would be an interesting debate.
Perhaps a topic for the main board …

Jokes aside, he's actually flying under the radar and I believe it all comes down to how he was recruited. IF we'd selected him with pick 6 in the 2020 draft he'd arguably be rated a lot higher amongst the general AFL supporter base.

 

[Roby]

Would have thought the return on investment for the hawks and their highest rated draft pick in this rebuild would be considered a very serious matter by Mitchell and the club …

What do you mean highest rated? I'd say Newcombe who's ranked 20th in the AFL player ratings is our highest rated pick even if it was in the mid season draft.

Hawthorn's previous year's pick Will Day was taken at pick 14, and he was rated very highly much higher than DGB, we had Will rated as top 6 talent and that seems to be proven right too.

So I think you've misunderstood how we rate and and how we rank our players.

 

[Red Bull]

What do you mean highest rated? I'd say Newcombe who's ranked 20th in the AFL player ratings is our highest rated pick even if it was in the mid season draft.

Hawthorn's previous year's pick Will Day was taken at pick 14, and he was rated very highly much higher than DGB, we had Will rated as top 6 talent and that seems to be proven right too.

So I think you've misunderstood how we rate and and how we rank our players.

Ranked/rated … whatever.
If it makes you feel better about DGB … knock yourself out

 

[Guardian Hawk]

Ranked/rated … whatever.
If it makes you feel better about DGB … knock yourself out

Look, I can admit that DGB has not come along as we'd hoped yet. There is still time but it is disappointing with a pick 6, especially one that fills a current need on the list.

However, no team nails every draft pick. And to be successful (win a flag), you don't need to. Hell, even the Hawthorn threepeat team has its share of high draft pick misses.

The key to being successful at the draft is to get more right than you don't (and to do so more often than your direct competitors). On those fronts, I think we are tracking ok, particularly with the value we have gotten from late and mid season picks.

The other potential problem is missing on a top draft pick is whether it is reflective of a talent identification issue. But everyone in the industry (and basically every club recruiter) were unanimous that there were a standout 6 that year and we picked DGB with the 6th selection (having bid on Campbell). Not to mention, that the draft in general has turned out to be relatively weak (makes sense with COVID) and thjat that Hawthorn came away with some pf the better prospects regardless,