Autopsy Roast, toast vs Sydney and changes for Port Adelaide in two weeks

Best vs Sydney

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IN: Pickett, Balta, Cumberland

OUT: Castagna, Edwards, Soldo

Hugo dished up a great game, would take him over Castagna every day, dont know how Castagna manages to still be in the best 22 when players like Cumberland etc dont get a go.

Dont think well need Soldo for this one

Edwards to be the Sub to allow for Cumberland to come through

Hopefully Balta gets up, he and Tarrant should keep Dixon quiet

Its a must win and so is the Carlton game
 
So I'm finally back from Sydney. Couple of points:
1) Swans supporters, to generalise, are a different breed of cat. First time ever I've moved seats to escape idiots. THey weren't aggressive or obnoxious, just stupid, talked all the way thru the footy (not about the footy). Idiots were abusing Dusty Q1, overrrated, etc just as he wheeled off the mark and drilled the goal from 50. I just turned around and eyeballed the idiot. Last qtr the crowd behind me were more interested in skulling competitions than the footy. And they had those clapping things! **** they were loud...and incessant. Lastly on the SCG. Nice ground, would be great for the Test cricket. But the seats the Swans allocated Tiges were a disgrace. Anyone notice they stuck the cheer squad in the pocket rather than behind the goals? And Tiges VFL players, staff and players families were right up the back, level 3 in the nose bleed section with the skulling competition idiots. Saw JRs folks there...don't reckon Joe was happy at all. We should reciprocate.
2) The game. Turnovers were the difference. Even then shots on goal in Q4 should have been enough, but we couldn't convert.
Changes. In Mansell for MRJ, Balta for Cumbo, Pickett for Soldo/George depending on structure vs Port.

ps. Viv'd in Sydney on the weekend. Very good. Manly ferry for brunch (Hoos !) was mint on Sunday. Flight home cancelled. Virgin are campaigners just like Dogstar. Was in airport for 6hours waiting to get home (beers $12)
 
Livonski said:
So I'm finally back from Sydney. Couple of points:
1) Swans supporters, to generalise, are a different breed of cat. First time ever I've moved seats to escape idiots. THey weren't aggressive or obnoxious, just stupid, talked all the way thru the footy (not about the footy). Idiots were abusing Dusty Q1, overrrated, etc just as he wheeled off the mark and drilled the goal from 50. I just turned around and eyeballed the idiot. Last qtr the crowd behind me were more interested in skulling competitions than the footy. And they had those clapping things! duck they were loud...and incessant. Lastly on the SCG. Nice ground, would be great for the Test cricket. But the seats the Swans allocated Tiges were a disgrace. Anyone notice they stuck the cheer squad in the pocket rather than behind the goals? And Tiges VFL players, staff and players families were right up the back, level 3 in the nose bleed section with the skulling competition idiots. Saw JRs folks there...don't reckon Joe was happy at all. We should reciprocate.
2) The game. Turnovers were the difference. Even then shots on goal in Q4 should have been enough, but we couldn't convert.
Changes. In Mansell for MRJ, Balta for Cumbo, Pickett for Soldo/George depending on structure vs Port.

ps. Viv'd in Sydney on the weekend. Very good. Manly ferry for brunch (Hoos !) was mint on Sunday. Flight home cancelled. Virgin are campaigners just like Dogstar. Was in airport for 6hours waiting to get home (beers $12)
Click to expand...
You were dealing with rugby supporters.
 

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Livonski said:
So I'm finally back from Sydney. Couple of points:
1) Swans supporters, to generalise, are a different breed of cat. First time ever I've moved seats to escape idiots. THey weren't aggressive or obnoxious, just stupid, talked all the way thru the footy (not about the footy). Idiots were abusing Dusty Q1, overrrated, etc just as he wheeled off the mark and drilled the goal from 50. I just turned around and eyeballed the idiot. Last qtr the crowd behind me were more interested in skulling competitions than the footy. And they had those clapping things! duck they were loud...and incessant. Lastly on the SCG. Nice ground, would be great for the Test cricket. But the seats the Swans allocated Tiges were a disgrace. Anyone notice they stuck the cheer squad in the pocket rather than behind the goals? And Tiges VFL players, staff and players families were right up the back, level 3 in the nose bleed section with the skulling competition idiots. Saw JRs folks there...don't reckon Joe was happy at all. We should reciprocate.
2) The game. Turnovers were the difference. Even then shots on goal in Q4 should have been enough, but we couldn't convert.
Changes. In Mansell for MRJ, Balta for Cumbo, Pickett for Soldo/George depending on structure vs Port.

ps. Viv'd in Sydney on the weekend. Very good. Manly ferry for brunch (Hoos !) was mint on Sunday. Flight home cancelled. Virgin are campaigners just like Dogstar. Was in airport for 6hours waiting to get home (beers $12)
Click to expand...
Mansell really going that well in the small forward role after 2 trials? Saw a brief bit of the VFL vs Sydney and he only had the ball a couple of times, one being a set shot 20 out directly in front that he shanked. Not sure Mansell is the answer all of a sudden, Cumberland or Stack surely before him?
 
Nostradumbass said:
You were dealing with rugby supporters.
Click to expand...
Accurate. There's plenty of boofhead AFL supporters in the crowd but at least they're generally there to watch the footy. Rugby crowds mostly just sink piss and talk shit the whole time. Come to life when there's a rare moment of excitement amidst the exercise of big burly boys bumping into each other ad nauseum.
 
Here is how I see us moving forward...

B: Broad, Balta, Gibcus or Tarrant
HB: Vlastuin, Grimes, Baker
C: McIntosh, Cotchin, Pickett
HF: Edwards, Riewoldt, Lambert
F: Bolton, Lynch, M. Rioli
R: Nankervis, Martin, Prestia
Int: Soldo, D. Rioli, Graham, Short

- Once Balta is back we should only play one of Gibcus or Tarrant, my preference being Gibcus and just playing Tarrant when Gibcus needs a rest or another tall gets injured.

- The 19 that are unbolded are locked in best/most competitive side.

- Some may say why Edwards? He's still best 22, if we make finals would you prefer a raw Ralphsmith/Dow or Edwards who, aside from some fadeouts, has looked pretty good the past few weeks?

- Some may say McIntosh isn't a lock but if we wanna challenge then he is, again, I'd have him over a raw kid in the same position.

The bolded three...

- Lambert, obviously a lock but his body won't allow that every week, so when unavailable we play Ross for more midfield support, otherwise give Sonsie, Dow or even Clarke a go.

- M. Rioli, I say we only play him and not both he and Castagna, but even MRJ's spot isn't locked in for mine. I'd be giving a run to Cumberland or Clarke, and I'd still love to see Stack get another go. What we really lack here is a small/medium guy that can take a strong overhead mark as well as provide quality ground-level play + offer pressure, and I think Cumberland and Stack can both take a grab. I'd love if this position had been filled by Jamie Elliot, for example.

- Soldo, still not personally fully sold on two ruckmen and at times Soldo is kind of a spud. If this was Luke Jackson then it'd be 100 percent, but it's Ivan Soldo and more often than not I think I'd just prefer another midfielder. For me that's Jack Ross, despite his issues he is the next best that we have available outside the 22, unless of course Sonsie gets a run soon and shows plenty at the level.


So we have 19 fully locked in and 3 spots up for grabs, though 1 is Lambert's when fit to play. So effectively 20 locked in.

The biggest issue if you ask me is whether or not we continue to bother playing the "pressure smalls"... Would you prefer 2 handball Castagna and oft-missing and still-raw-lacking-tank Maurice, OR to just pick two more quality footballers and sacrifice a little pressure (are Castagna and MRJ really offering that much pressure anyway..) ?

For me I think the pressure is nice in theory, but it's rarely amounting to much these days. Sydney still kicked 106. If we were pressuring and getting the ball back that number should be a lot lower. So then we have to turn to the opposite, ball in hand, would we prefer a resting Bolton/Dusty up forward with more support in the midfield instead (Ross/Dow/Ralphsmith) and/or a dangerous Stack who can at least take a mark and is a talented footballer, or to have Castagna/MRJ with the ball?

I personally think we should be moving away from playing those smalls just for the sake of pressure, and instead picking our best 22 footballers. Play 2 extra midfielders if we have to, at least it's then safer to have other mids rest forward.

Keen on other people's thoughts, cheers...
 
RobsJourney said:
Here is how I see us moving forward...

B: Broad, Balta, Gibcus or Tarrant
HB: Vlastuin, Grimes, Baker
C: McIntosh, Cotchin, Pickett
HF: Edwards, Riewoldt, Lambert
F: Bolton, Lynch, M. Rioli
R: Nankervis, Martin, Prestia
Int: Soldo, D. Rioli, Graham, Short

- Once Balta is back we should only play one of Gibcus or Tarrant, my preference being Gibcus and just playing Tarrant when Gibcus needs a rest or another tall gets injured.

- The 19 that are unbolded are locked in best/most competitive side.

- Some may say why Edwards? He's still best 22, if we make finals would you prefer a raw Ralphsmith/Dow or Edwards who, aside from some fadeouts, has looked pretty good the past few weeks?

- Some may say McIntosh isn't a lock but if we wanna challenge then he is, again, I'd have him over a raw kid in the same position.

The bolded three...

- Lambert, obviously a lock but his body won't allow that every week, so when unavailable we play Ross for more midfield support, otherwise give Sonsie, Dow or even Clarke a go.

- M. Rioli, I say we only play him and not both he and Castagna, but even MRJ's spot isn't locked in for mine. I'd be giving a run to Cumberland or Clarke, and I'd still love to see Stack get another go. What we really lack here is a small/medium guy that can take a strong overhead mark as well as provide quality ground-level play + offer pressure, and I think Cumberland and Stack can both take a grab. I'd love if this position had been filled by Jamie Elliot, for example.

- Soldo, still not personally fully sold on two ruckmen and at times Soldo is kind of a spud. If this was Luke Jackson then it'd be 100 percent, but it's Ivan Soldo and more often than not I think I'd just prefer another midfielder. For me that's Jack Ross, despite his issues he is the next best that we have available outside the 22, unless of course Sonsie gets a run soon and shows plenty at the level.


So we have 19 fully locked in and 3 spots up for grabs, though 1 is Lambert's when fit to play. So effectively 20 locked in.

The biggest issue if you ask me is whether or not we continue to bother playing the "pressure smalls"... Would you prefer 2 handball Castagna and oft-missing and still-raw-lacking-tank Maurice, OR to just pick two more quality footballers and sacrifice a little pressure (are Castagna and MRJ really offering that much pressure anyway..) ?

For me I think the pressure is nice in theory, but it's rarely amounting to much these days. Sydney still kicked 106. If we were pressuring and getting the ball back that number should be a lot lower. So then we have to turn to the opposite, ball in hand, would we prefer a resting Bolton/Dusty up forward with more support in the midfield instead (Ross/Dow/Ralphsmith) and/or a dangerous Stack who can at least take a mark and is a talented footballer, or to have Castagna/MRJ with the ball?

I personally think we should be moving away from playing those smalls just for the sake of pressure, and instead picking our best 22 footballers. Play 2 extra midfielders if we have to, at least it's then safer to have other mids rest forward.

Keen on other people's thoughts, cheers...
Click to expand...
Soldo is a great second ruckman. Hes never going to be elite, never going to go forward and kick a bag, but you know what you're getting. He will mostly break even around the ground against any of the leagues ruckman, but if we're expecting him to win us games week in and out we're always gonna be dissapointed. Soldo playing means we keep Balta and Lynch away from the ruck and where they can do the most damage.
 
PuntRd_Seal said:
Soldo is a great second ruckman. Hes never going to be elite, never going to go forward and kick a bag, but you know what you're getting. He will mostly break even around the ground against any of the leagues ruckman, but if we're expecting him to win us games week in and out we're always gonna be dissapointed. Soldo playing means we keep Balta and Lynch away from the ruck and where they can do the most damage.
Click to expand...
True, fair call.

But what about the pressure smalls? If they aren't really offering enough pressure (and I don't think they are, personally) then we have to look at the flipside and their output in general; possessions, goals, passing efficiency etc. Two handballs from Castagna and not too much from MRJ. What if Pickett had been fit and played in their place, and maybe Dow had played as well, deepening the midfield? More midfield rotations, better inside 50 entries, more time resting forward for Dusty and Shai etc.

I just wonder if we should trial moving away from playing the smalls for their pressure, and just picking better players who can get the ball more often and do more damage with it (or just make less mistakes with it). Remember Geelong for example? They didn't pick Chapman and Stevie J for their pressure, they were picked because they were gun footballers who just happened to be good forwards, but both could do damage in the midfield too. I know we're a different beast and I know George has played in 3 flags, but wouldn't you prefer to see some more quality injected?

I doubt we'll see it but I hope we do...
 
RobsJourney said:
True, fair call.

But what about the pressure smalls? If they aren't really offering enough pressure (and I don't think they are, personally) then we have to look at the flipside and their output in general; possessions, goals, passing efficiency etc. Two handballs from Castagna and not too much from MRJ. What if Pickett had been fit and played in their place, and maybe Dow had played as well, deepening the midfield? More midfield rotations, better inside 50 entries, more time resting forward for Dusty and Shai etc.

I just wonder if we should trial moving away from playing the smalls for their pressure, and just picking better players who can get the ball more often and do more damage with it (or just make less mistakes with it). Remember Geelong for example? They didn't pick Chapman and Stevie J for their pressure, they were picked because they were gun footballers who just happened to be good forwards, but both could do damage in the midfield too. I know we're a different beast and I know George has played in 3 flags, but wouldn't you prefer to see some more quality injected?

I doubt we'll see it but I hope we do...
Click to expand...

Pressure is important but its a balance. Pies and other teams seem to be copying us a bit. I see where you are coming from I think where players and teams need a few strings to win a few different ways to make the combinations stronger
 
Last edited:
Mr Magic said:
Pressure is important but its a balance. Pies and other teams seem to be copying us a bit
Click to expand...
Yeah but most of their pressure is midfield based if I'm not mistaken, like ours used to be (it was also forward pressure then too, yes, but midfield pressure was elite then).

Right now I'd say George and Maurice aren't offering enough pressure to offset their lack of possessions and quality when they do get it. Based on this what is the point of playing them?

Pies, for example, play Elliott and Ginnivan, clearly more quality players than George and Maurice (btw I still have high hopes for Maurice). Elliott can take a strong grab for his size and is just a very talented footballer. Ginnivan is dangerous. Which duo would you prefer? If you added those to Richmond's 22 in place of George and Maurice you'd have to think we'd be a 5 or so percent better side. But I wouldn't associate Elliott and Ginnivan with pressure, just quality. I think that's the direction we need to go. The side as a whole can still pressure, we don't need zippy smalls to do it and not otherwise be that involved in the game, or stuff it up if they do get it.
 
RobsJourney said:
Yeah but most of their pressure is midfield based if I'm not mistaken, like ours used to be (it was also forward pressure then too, yes, but midfield pressure was elite then).

Right now I'd say George and Maurice aren't offering enough pressure to offset their lack of possessions and quality when they do get it. Based on this what is the point of playing them?

Pies, for example, play Elliott and Ginnivan, clearly more quality players than George and Maurice (btw I still have high hopes for Maurice). Elliott can take a strong grab for his size and is just a very talented footballer. Ginnivan is dangerous. Which duo would you prefer? If you added those to Richmond's 22 in place of George and Maurice you'd have to think we'd be a 5 or so percent better side. But I wouldn't associate Elliott and Ginnivan with pressure, just quality. I think that's the direction we need to go. The side as a whole can still pressure, we don't need zippy smalls to do it and not otherwise be that involved in the game, or stuff it up if they do get it.
Click to expand...
I think Ginnivan is overrrated, never seen so much hype, it must be the blonde hair.

but I see where you are coming from I think.
 
Livonski said:
So I'm finally back from Sydney. Couple of points:
1) Swans supporters, to generalise, are a different breed of cat. First time ever I've moved seats to escape idiots. THey weren't aggressive or obnoxious, just stupid, talked all the way thru the footy (not about the footy). Idiots were abusing Dusty Q1, overrrated, etc just as he wheeled off the mark and drilled the goal from 50. I just turned around and eyeballed the idiot. Last qtr the crowd behind me were more interested in skulling competitions than the footy. And they had those clapping things! duck they were loud...and incessant. Lastly on the SCG. Nice ground, would be great for the Test cricket. But the seats the Swans allocated Tiges were a disgrace. Anyone notice they stuck the cheer squad in the pocket rather than behind the goals? And Tiges VFL players, staff and players families were right up the back, level 3 in the nose bleed section with the skulling competition idiots. Saw JRs folks there...don't reckon Joe was happy at all. We should reciprocate.
2) The game. Turnovers were the difference. Even then shots on goal in Q4 should have been enough, but we couldn't convert.
Changes. In Mansell for MRJ, Balta for Cumbo, Pickett for Soldo/George depending on structure vs Port.

ps. Viv'd in Sydney on the weekend. Very good. Manly ferry for brunch (Hoos !) was mint on Sunday. Flight home cancelled. Virgin are campaigners just like Dogstar. Was in airport for 6hours waiting to get home (beers $12)
Click to expand...

How did your mate Castagna go in the skulling competition??
Might explain why he was MIA all night?
Sightings of George in the action on Friday were rare than sightings of the notorious Grampians panther. ;) ;)
PS F*** .... $12 a beer.
Might need a bank loan to drink at the airport next time I fly.
 
RobsJourney said:
True, fair call.

But what about the pressure smalls? If they aren't really offering enough pressure (and I don't think they are, personally) then we have to look at the flipside and their output in general; possessions, goals, passing efficiency etc. Two handballs from Castagna and not too much from MRJ. What if Pickett had been fit and played in their place, and maybe Dow had played as well, deepening the midfield? More midfield rotations, better inside 50 entries, more time resting forward for Dusty and Shai etc.

I just wonder if we should trial moving away from playing the smalls for their pressure, and just picking better players who can get the ball more often and do more damage with it (or just make less mistakes with it). Remember Geelong for example? They didn't pick Chapman and Stevie J for their pressure, they were picked because they were gun footballers who just happened to be good forwards, but both could do damage in the midfield too. I know we're a different beast and I know George has played in 3 flags, but wouldn't you prefer to see some more quality injected?

I doubt we'll see it but I hope we do...
Click to expand...
I think MRJ is fine, we've persisted with George for 3 seasons and Aarts for 1 1/2. Im happy to allow him some time. I think the only knock on him is his overall fitness (why his output is dropping) and he seems very rushed with his possesions, but that'll only improve being tested at AFL level. Looking to the future we need to start getting Cumberland and Clarke looks in. If they're dangerous up FWD we dont need MRJ to get 15+ and kick 3. He can actually just run, chase, and harrass. - George IMO now should only play to rest either of those guys (unless he is DESTROYING the VFL)
 

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Tiger_Of_Old said:
I'd love to give Clarke a go against Port @ the G.
We're in a bit of a spot with Cumberland though.
Hate for the records to show he's played one game when he hasn't really.
Maybe give him that game against Norf.
Click to expand...
Why not give him that go next week. He’s ****ing deserves a go.
 
Been reflecting all week on why we continually cough up big leads in games

I believe post-dynasty Richmond as a team lack mental resilience

Not in the sense that the team goes into their shells, or plays risk averse footy (we saw Cotch's kamikaze bravery when game was on the line)

More in the sense that when oppo inevitably get a good run of momentum (as happens in every game), we mentally fry as a team... We don't have the composure to absorb a team playing better than us. What ensues is silly free kicks, late bumps, stupid 50s, rushed shots for goal & an all round headless performance that let's opposition team back in. They see our cage is rattled & grow in confidence

This is kind of perplexing, as it was once the teams greatest asset. I remember all the commentary around "staying in the moment", "focus on the next contest", "move on from mistakes" that was credited to Emma Murray's great work

If we win one or two of the carlton/st kilda/sydney games, we are knocking on the door of the top 4. Hodgey even said "we're back" to our premiership best in the first half against Sydney ... only us dye to the wool fans know we have had the shakes defending a lead for 18 months
 
smasha said:
Well 2 weeks,grand final parade at Alberton next week.

Umps will probably train with them.
Click to expand...
Port can bring whatever the hell they want but their gonna get hit by the Tiger Train after the bye.
Loop City GIF
 
I had a look at the second half.

We should never have lost that match,

We should never have got near losing that match. It was a achievement to snatch defeat out of the jaws of victory but I will not go into war and peace

It looked like Gibcus went forward in the last four minutes or so.

Before he got that ball there was a ball that was bombed to MR where his defenders where too tall for him. If Gibcus had a bit more experience and confidence he could have leap for that ball, from behind, taken the mark and who knows.

I think Gibcus should stay forward even for longevity while his frame is only slight. He can play with JR and Lynch no problem.

Sign up Gibcus for ten years
 
Last edited:
RobsJourney said:
Ginnivan is dangerous. Which duo would you prefer?
Click to expand...

Elliott is a gun and has footy smarts. Can play tall if need be.

GinnaGIRL would not get a game in our team. Because he is a cat, won't tackle, won't apply pressure, won't go in and get his own ball but he sure will duck on the slightest contact. Most of his goals have come from free's.
 

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