Autopsy Round 19 = Hawthorn 133-67 Collingwood

[loki04]

And Adams would have come in handy without Mitchell

That was another poor decision.

Adams, Ginni and Murphy ( medically retired) outs.
That alone is a big change to team dynamics, add in injuries, a gameplan directed to within an inch of its life and ageing list...not surprisingly the wheels have fallen off.

 

[barrackers]

TBH I feel for Hine the amount that of top 10 picks we have traded out is mind blowing over 10 years.
Imo the stephenson vs Naughton call should haunt him. People will defend the Stephenson selection off 1 season 2018 but it has literally been a 1 off season and it was short sightedness.
His refusal to invest in KPF low in drafts also needs questioning.

McCreery and Harrison look quality hits.

However McClarty, Poulter, McMahon, among other huge busts given he was a part of the decision to trade a top 5 pick for picks in 20, 30s etc.

Again Schultz trade killing us long term it was such a short sighted almost hubris decision that seemingly lacked any thought into a what about the other side of the coin argument.

Ageing list read oldest list. Injuries more likely with each year especially when completing multiple finals series.
Dearth of TOP end talent coming through pushing senior players.
Won 11 games by under 10 points.
Hunted instead of Hunter.
B2B historically is hard feat that only the truly dominant teams have pulled off.
Lost a heart and soul warrior type in Adams and a team larrikin 1 touch clean clutch player in Ginnivan. Team dynamics upset.
We lost more then we gained.

We’ve also traded back or out our picks when we’ve had father son (Daicos) or academy (Quaynor, McInnes). The advantage is trading up to beat the bid and get an extra shot at a talented youngster

 

[loki04]

Seasons only going to get worse from here and having one of the oldest teams in the comp is just pushing the likelihood of a big rebuild this offseason. I love Pendles and Siddy but I don’t think the contract extensions would have been offered had we known we’d be in this situation. Howe, Mitchell, Sidebottom, Markov, Ash and possibly Pendles might need to retire or be moved on. I just bloody hope they do not stuff up again and trade anymore 1st rounders yikes

How do we go big rebuild with no picks?
Hell even the picks we got from Hawks looking increasingly shit too.

 

[mumblingpie]

Richmond is basically already 2 yrs in front of us with their rebuild, they have bargaining chips that will bring in plenty of future picks as well, we unfortunately don’t have that luxury and will need to absolutely nail and picks moving forward

 

[Greenaicos]

Since the bye, any team that beats us loses the next week, Geelong to lose today. Hawks to lose to Crows next week. It’s the Collingwood curse.

 

[mumblingpie]

How do we go big rebuild with no picks?
Hell even the picks we got from Hawks looking increasingly shit too.

We have our 2025 1st? Surely we weren’t silly enough to trade that

 

[bucksisbest]

He was seething below that calm exterior.

Was he?!
Gee whiz, sounds like we'll have to get to work Monday!

 

[Brad Goodman]

Crisp, Sidey, Pendles, and Howe among our best players today.

Hence why we lost by 11 goals to an ok but not brilliant team

 

[LuckyLee]

How do we go big rebuild with no picks?
Hell even the picks we got from Hawks looking increasingly shit too.

Is there any chance that teams will soon be able to trade picks for cash, like in the NBA?

That’s our only hope other than free agency, because we’re a rich club and with a plethora of imminent retirements, we’re going to have lots of cash, list spots and salary cap space to buy picks from the likes of North, GWS and GC who will have full, talented lists and could use the dollars.


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[sr36]

Spot on Geelong doesn't give them away, they trade them in (Bowes and pick 7 for cap space) and also go after match winning stars in Dangerfield, Cameron, Smith, Thouhey etc.

They traded out a heap.

In the 12 drafts from 2010-21 - These are the only first round picks that the Cats took to the draft:

Billie Smedts pick 15
Jackson THurlow pick 16
Darcy Lang pick 16
Nakia Cockatoo pick 10,
Cooper stephens pick 16
Jordan Clark pick 15

 

[loki04]

We’ve also traded back or out our picks when we’ve had father son (Daicos) or academy (Quaynor, McInnes). The advantage is trading up to beat the bid and get an extra shot at a talented youngster

Except they shit the bed with the Nick Daicos pick 2 by not waiting for his draft year to know the pick they hold (again burnt by a future pick trade).

Similar to trading for Schultz last year looking top 5.

Also traded top 5 pick for McMahon/Poulter picks in 2020.


Treloar 2 x pick 7. Then trade him to Dogs for peanuts and pay him to bury us like last game where he was BoG imo. Still a very quality mid and would make us instantly better.

Lose top 5 ruck in Grundy for a pack of twisties and pay him to play against us.

Lost one of our gut running hard nosed passionate inside mids in Adams for crap.

Gave Ginnivan away.

Lost pick 6 Stephenson for a dogs breakfast.
Lost first rounder O.Henry to a competitor for an extra bread roll for Scotty Cummings.


So much young talent missed out on its crazy.

 

[Mollythedolly]

If we are serious, Ned Long just played his last game of football for the Collingwood football club. How we selected him when our experts were able to watch him close up is beyond me. He is as slow as a sloth. He cannot get to a contest and when he does he gets tackled and loses the pill. He is a poor kick to boot. What were they thinking? If he is selected again I'll know our club has lost the plot. We can't even tank for a draft pick.

Wouldn't put too much weight on his performance today. I doubt we recruited him to play the 2nd ruck role, or that he has a lot of experience in it. Still has time and shown at VFL level that he can cut the mustard in the midfield.

 

[greening22]

Harvey Harrison, too. He has had a great debut season and is a keeper. Has scored regularly and has had many goal assists. The only U22 player on our list better than him is Nick, albeit by a huge margin. I have hopes for DeMattia, Allan, Steene and Smit but that’s all. So our depth of youth is very poor - perhaps worst in the comp.


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. too. He has had a great debut season and is a keeper. Has scored regularly and has had many goal assists. The only U22 player on our list better than him is Nick, albeit by a huge margin. I have hopes for DeMattia, Allan, Steene and Smit but that’s all. So our depth of youth is very poor - perhaps worst in the comp.

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[Mollythedolly]

You're talking as though he's a 15 year vet.

He is currently a good player. He was a good player for us in 2022. I agree he has a lot of potential, but dunno about destined to be very good.

Happy for you to bookmark this and bump it in 2035 saying I was wrong but atm it's just conjecture. He could be a hall of famer, or could be delisted in a gee years. Ya never know.


One thing is for sure - he'll always be a Collingwood Premiership Player

"Destined" suggests anything other than him already being a veteran, or that he's there yet.

 

[greening22]

Harvey Harrison, too. He has had a great debut season and is a keeper. Has scored regularly and has had many goal assists. The only U22 player on our list better than him is Nick, albeit by a huge margin. I have hopes for DeMattia, Allan, Steene and Smit but that’s all. So our depth of youth is very poor - perhaps worst in the comp.


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I agree totally. Our youth stocks are extremely thin. Now who do I blame for that? Derek Hine! How he gets to keep his job after all of these years is simply beyond me. I simply have no cofidence in him to select the right players for this club in terms of our glaring weaknesses

 

[rand corp]

It's give the kids a run time. Need to work out how many, (if not all) of the 30 plus year olds we are going to pension off at seasons end. No high draft picks in sight. It was carnage out there, as it is on here.

 

[crackerss08]

Well done pies … make sure you keep up your instagram reels and YouTube clips laughing and showing that everything is on the right track.. if I kept on performing sub par for my employer I would be shown the door!! Our players have a free pass to carry on like rock stars the performances after the bye have been oddly shocking!! We beat Melbourne with more outs than today. Moore you are rubbish.. from that deplorable performance last year against the hawks you have regressed but fortunately, you are a protected species.. stop concentrating on oratory and start playing to you potential…

 

[LuckyLee]

A 50:50 game against the (improving) Tigers next week then a trio of consecutive games against the Blues, Swans and Lions.

So if you think things look bad now, imagine how it will all look in a month’s time!


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[carndapies]

One thing I have heard with regard to this draft is that it is extremely even amongst the top 30 odd players. Hopefully Hine can find a gem or two. Maybe that played into the thinking of trading the 1st round draft pick (as well as us thinking we would be top 4 this year)

 

[Looney]

I don't care if we are shit for the rest of the season, just as long as Carlton or Essendon don't win the premiership.

 

[JLC]

Harvey Harrison, too. He has had a great debut season and is a keeper. Has scored regularly and has had many goal assists. The only U22 player on our list better than him is Nick, albeit by a huge margin. I have holes for DeMattia, Allan, Steene and Smit but that’s all. So our depth of youth is very poor - perhaps worst in the comp.


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Yeah agree on Harrison but still has a bit to go.

Steene and Smit imo are long shots and for our game plan and style not that critical.

We have invested a fair bit into Fin Macrae and looks like that's a bust. Bytel, Sullivan and Long are ok but not up to Tay Tay and I don't even rate Tay Tay that highly. So to me the inside mid role has been a massive bust.

We still have not found a winger to replace Steele?

We have thrown a few darts at the board to replace Howe but apart from Jiath I see the rest as a bust.

I also remember hearing if you can't run then you won't be getting a game at Collingwood? Was that from Hine? Can't remember who. But today our run and spread was pretty poor. We look old and slow.

I think we definitely need a player like Houston in the back half - we need some better foot skills and depth to their kicking. But that's like one hole and there are so many to plug.

We really need our list manager and recruiter to earn their money.

 

[sr36]

We’ve also traded back or out our picks when we’ve had father son (Daicos) or academy (Quaynor, McInnes). The advantage is trading up to beat the bid and get an extra shot at a talented youngster

Or into the future. GWS didn't just get all those matching points for their early pick last year - they also got two first round picks.

 

[Lunchtime]

The part which most annoyed me is that Fly challenged the group and they didn't give a yelp.

Are the players gassed? They don't care? Or is there a deeper problem?

Was talking to someone post game and for the first time I heard Fly linked with the Tassie job? Surely not? GW was also mentioned but that is common knowledge.

Really? Fly to leave Pies and coach Tassie? Any truth to it at all????

 

[JLC]

Seasons only going to get worse from here and having one of the oldest teams in the comp is just pushing the likelihood of a big rebuild this offseason. I love Pendles and Siddy but I don’t think the contract extensions would have been offered had we known we’d be in this situation. Howe, Mitchell, Sidebottom, Markov, Ash and possibly Pendles might need to retire or be moved on. I just bloody hope they do not stuff up again and trade anymore 1st rounders yikes

Markov is a nomad for a reason - I am just glad he helped us win a flag. A premiership would have been a dream come true. Mountain climbed. Great bloke but time to go. Wouldn't mind of he just became a full time VFL along with Sullivan.

I think Ash Johnson has checked out - the guy is not a complete idiot. He kicks 5 goals in the VFL but doesn't get selected. He knows he is done.

Macrae must know Sullivan getting a game ahead of him means his papers are stamped.

I think Mitchell served his purpose and won a flag. I reckon he is pretty content. Happy to keep nut not expecting much more.

 

[FromTheBoundaryLine]

Fly’s demeanour and statements in the press conference indicate to me that the players will know exactly what’s required going forward. Seems like the team hit a bit of a threshold for him today and we are on a bit of an edge. He’s clearly concerned that some of that “winners” mentality is slipping. Back to work, side by side, back each other sometimes sounds clichéd after a loss but the fact remains it’s the only way. We don’t give up and work with what’s in front of us.

Last years trades are over, public tirades of anger would probably see a coach sacked these days, the playing list won’t change until next year so this is where we are. Fight to the end then deal with the next thing as it happens.