Autopsy Round 19 = Hawthorn 133-67 Collingwood

[loki04]

They traded out a heap.

In the 12 drafts from 2010-21 - These are the only first round picks that the Cats took to the draft:

Billie Smedts pick 15
Jackson THurlow pick 16
Darcy Lang pick 16
Nakia Cockatoo pick 10,
Cooper stephens pick 16
Jordan Clark pick 15

That was for Dangerfield 2015 (one of the best mids in comp at the time) ,
Thouhey (AA HB) 2016,
Ablett jnr and Tim Kelly #24 pick 2017 also had pick #22 L.Foggarty .
Cameron for 3 in top 20 2019 (freak Fwd Coleman medalist).

Not for a work horse fp.

 

[JLC]

Really? Fly to leave Pies and coach Tassie? Any truth to it at all????

I guess we will find out in due course. I hope it is incorrect.

 

[domus]

Wouldn't put too much weight on his performance today. I doubt we recruited him to play the 2nd ruck role, or that he has a lot of experience in it. Still has time and shown at VFL level that he can cut the mustard in the midfield.

He is just too slow. He can still run as a ruckman and get his hands on the pill. He played up forward too and could not apply any pressure on their running defenders. There was nowhere to hide him in the end.

 

[BigVic]

Sigh. 295 days since the flag and we are now 13th

 

[LuckyLee]

Except they shit the bed with the Nick Daicos pick 2 by not waiting for his draft year to know the pick they hold (again burnt by a future pick trade).

Similar to trading for Schultz last year looking top 5.

Also traded top 5 pick for McMahon/Poulter picks in 2020.


Treloar 2 x pick 7. Then trade him to Dogs for peanuts and pay him to bury us like last game where he was BoG imo. Still a very quality mid and would make us instantly better.

Lose top 5 ruck in Grundy for a pack of twisties and pay him to play against us.

Lost one of our gut running hard nosed passionate inside mids in Adams for crap.

Gave Ginnivan away.

Lost pick 6 Stephenson for a dogs breakfast.
Lost first rounder O.Henry to a competitor for an extra bread roll for Scotty Cummings.


So much young talent missed out on its crazy.

Yes, our list and salary cap management over recent years has been scandalous - worst in the comp. We should have a dynasty team rather than a single, snatched Premiership.


Sent from my iPhone using BigFooty.com

 

[stormskye]

Sigh. 295 days since the flag and we are now 13th

Carlton sit 2nd. and it’s been around 10585 days since their last flag. I know which situation id prefer

 

[domus]

You're talking as though he's a 15 year vet.

He is currently a good player. He was a good player for us in 2022. I agree he has a lot of potential, but dunno about destined to be very good.

Happy for you to bookmark this and bump it in 2035 saying I was wrong but atm it's just conjecture. He could be a hall of famer, or could be delisted in a gee years. Ya never know.


One thing is for sure - he'll always be a Collingwood Premiership Player

Given how he behaved on the eve of the final and his very vocal admission that he has always been a Hawk's man and going there was a dream come true, just tarnishes his place in that legendary team for mine.

 

[loki04]

And yet we have won the same number flags between 2010-2023.

They have started a new build and are back up there.

It's hard to see us rebounding in 2025 with some talented teams chasing hard and our juniour talent not up to the same standards. Both North Melb and Hawks on the up.

Sydney will stay strong.

 

[Finnishpie]

Carlton sit 2nd. and it’s been around 10585 days since their last flag. I know which situation id prefer

I take some heart that I rate Sydney, GwS and Bulldogs all a level above Blues at this stage.

 

[sr36]

That was for Dangerfield 2015 (one of the best mids in comp at the time) ,
Thouhey (AA HB) 2016,
Ablett jnr and Tim Kelly #24 pick 2017 also had pick #22 L.Foggarty .
Cameron for 3 in top 20 2019 (freak Fwd Coleman medalist).

Not for a work horse fp.

Yes they've made some great trades.

Henderson was for a future first though.

But the point I'm making is that the current cats team doesn't involve taking first round picks in the draft. I think Clarke, who isnt any good yet, is the only bloke in their team that they drafted in the first round.

There are lots of different ways to skin a cat

 

[PonsfordMagpie]

Our biggest losing margin under Fly, and very likely our worst performance under him. It confirms that our 2024 prospects are over now.

Apart from Darcy Cameron

14

Darcy Cameron

Age

29

Ht

204cm

Wt

103kg

Pos.

Ruck

Career

Season

Last 5

D

6.0

1star

K

3.3

1star

HB

2.7

2star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

D

7.5

2star

K

4.5

2star

HB

3.0

2star

CL

0.5

3star

HO

3.5

5star

D

6.0

2star

K

3.3

2star

HB

2.7

3star

CL

0.3

2star

HO

5.3

5star

and Nick Daicos, you really can't say anyone else was up to an acceptable standard. Just been too many passengers and downhill skiers this year. Given our season is almost done, we need to pump games into the likes of McInnes and give them some continuity. It's not benefiting their development constantly having them in and out of the team.

Our game plan is being picked apart now with the high uncontested possession game that opposition teams are implementing. It stops us playing our high pressure and turnover game that we were so accustomed to in 2022-2023. I don't know whether this issue can be solved this season, as changing a style of play mid-season is very difficult. Fly and the assistants "need to get back work" and figure out a way to counter it, otherwise this will keep happening. It's happened in three consecutive weeks now against Essendon, Geelong and Hawthorn.

Don't know what today means in the overall scheme of things. Is that the end of our premiership window and we need to start rebuilding with our ageing list, or do we have some sort of rebound next year with a longer off-season and the tag of us no longer being 'reigning' premiers wearing us down?

It's clear we need to get proactive and start making some tough calls on the list, especially around our ageing veterans. Today exposed how slow and lethargic we looked and we need to start having a serious eye on the future. I don't think topping up and going for short term fixes will help us that much to be honest.

The next five weeks will be a grind for the club and the supporter base. Need to get to the finish line and put a line through this season.

 

[loki04]

We have our 2025 1st? Surely we weren’t silly enough to trade that

Next years atm we do. But AFL are bringing in future first trading up to 2 years in advance.
I hope someone kidnaps our list managers come trade week...

 

[loki04]

Yes they've made some great trades.

Henderson was for a future first though.

But the point I'm making is that the current cats team doesn't involve taking first round picks in the draft. I think Clarke, who isnt any good yet, is the only bloke in their team that they drafted in the first round.

They have drafted well in the 20s and traded for guns.

 

[domus]

The ease with which opposition teams waltz out of the middle at most centre bounces is quite astonishing. It has been going on for years, even when we have been a quality side. What the hell are we doing in there? The few clearances we have are rarely clean and damaging.

Degoey can be put to pasture for the rest of the year-he can a hardly break out of a jog unless he gets the pill in hand and then it's a canter and Nick looked a shadow of himself today. He has to be carrying something. We look so slow all of a sudden.

 

[barrackers]

Wouldn't put too much weight on his performance today. I doubt we recruited him to play the 2nd ruck role, or that he has a lot of experience in it. Still has time and shown at VFL level that he can cut the mustard in the midfield.

With Long i think it’s inside mid or bust. He hasn’t had that role at senior level yet for us

 

[loki04]

One thing I have heard with regard to this draft is that it is extremely even amongst the top 30 odd players. Hopefully Hine can find a gem or two. Maybe that played into the thinking of trading the 1st round draft pick (as well as us thinking we would be top 4 this year)

They didn't rate the KPP this time last year apparently and now 12 months later there are a couple who are looking the goods.

 

[Run n Spread]

Given how he behaved on the eve of the final and his very vocal admission that he has always been a Hawk's man and going there was a dream come true, just tarnishes his place in that legendary team for mine.

Ahh bullshit. He was a young gun drafted during the covid bullshit and got he's chance and debuted in 2021.
Had a sensational year in 22 was in and out in 23 but a deserved premiership player in 23.
Than gets somehow traded out. (For what I'll never know)
Good luck.to.him but this was a major **** up
The game is about to trend in the ginnivan direction not the old fart control everyone don't do anything
It was a major list management mistake

 

[Black_White]

Fallen off the cliff big time.
Extremely disappointing. Didn’t think going b to b was achievable when looking cold and hard at the squad and the great run with injury/close results we had in ‘23. A lot of squad played above themselves and have now settled back into their level.
What was always needed this year was more 3rd tier players to step up. It hasn’t happened. And our second tier players have plateaued if not dropped back.
And watching Pendles today… well he might still be our onfield coach, but his football has slipped. He and Sidey have been stalwarts but of course time stands still for no one. With their inevitable end coming there had to be others stepping into those roles. I don’t see anyone putting their hand up. (Not including Daicos in this conversation because he is the icing on the cake of a classic Pendlebury performance)
That our players have not taken the next step when we have been cruelled by injury has been our downfall.

 

[stormskye]

They have drafted well in the 20s and traded for guns.

Missed finals after their flag. Well beaten tonight, could still miss finals themselves. And have only won one more flag than us in past 15 years.

 

[domus]

Ahh bullshit. He was a young gun drafted during the covid bullshit and got he's chance and debuted in 2021.
Had a sensational year in 22 was in and out in 23 but a deserved premiership player in 23.
Than gets somehow traded out. (For what I'll never know)
Good luck.to.him but this was a major **** up
The game is about to trend in the ginnivan direction not the old fart control everyone don't do anything
It was a major list management mistake

He was nicked off for off field behaviour. I think the coach and some players could not stand the boy. He is all class with the pill in hand and was devastating today. I still think Schultz will become a very valuable addition to our list. I always loved Ginnivan because he made things happen every time he touched the ball. He looks fitter and quicker at the Hawks.

 

[barrackers]

Markov is a nomad for a reason - I am just glad he helped us win a flag. A premiership would have been a dream come true. Mountain climbed. Great bloke but time to go. Wouldn't mind of he just became a full time VFL along with Sullivan.

I think Ash Johnson has checked out - the guy is not a complete idiot. He kicks 5 goals in the VFL but doesn't get selected. He knows he is done.

Macrae must know Sullivan getting a game ahead of him means his papers are stamped.

I think Mitchell served his purpose and won a flag. I reckon he is pretty content. Happy to keep nut not expecting much more.

To think Moyle and Durham were selected after Johnson. Whether it’s with us or someone else I hope Johnson gets another shot as he seems a good bloke

 

[leon123]

Missed finals after their flag. Well beaten tonight, could still miss finals themselves. And have only won one more flag than us in past 15 years.

Only one more flag is huge though

 

[Run n Spread]

He was nicked off for off field behaviour. I think the coach and some players could not stand the boy. He is all class with the pill in hand and was devastating today. I still think Schultz will become a very valuable addition to our list. I always loved Ginnivan because he made things happen every time he touched the ball. He looks fitter and quicker at the Hawks.

Honestly who would you prefer next decade?
What off field behaviour? A snort in the lorne pub (99% off footballers) and going to the races? Was a case of the club not liking him and drinking their own bathwater which was shown in the first 3 rounds and today to be a bad call
Really think the club pulled the wrong reign.

 

[soreplums]

Lipinski is smooth as silk and a beautiful kick. He’s not the one to move on. The problem is we don’t have a mix of fast legs in the midfield. When you’ve got nothing but one paced players in the midfield the team suffers. Even Nick Daicos is down on output because he doesn’t have any support around him.

If we can get something good for Lipinski, I’d take it.

 

[loki04]

The ease with which opposition teams waltz out of the middle at most centre bounces is quite astonishing. It has been going on for years, even when we have been a quality side. What the hell are we doing in there? The few clearances we have are rarely clean and damaging.

Degoey can be put to pasture for the rest of the year-he can a hardly break out of a jog unless he gets the pill in hand and then it's a canter and Nick looked a shadow of himself today. He has to be carrying something. We look so slow all of a sudden.

Also overlap handball and hard running forward is not being matched defensively by our team.