Autopsy Roast & Toast vs Collingwood & Changes for Melbourne

[JAKLAUGHING]

And Rance.

And Cotchin.

 

[tora tora tora]

Balta will get his chance when his fitness gets up but Rioli is building nicely. His pressure is excellent and there's no way Balta could run out games like Rioli. Ditto SL, even comparing those two is farcical. Wonder how their goal assists, score involvements and pressure acts compare...

Balta looked like he lacked fitness and ability to read the game. His output in his last couple of games was way below par. Partly because he was being asked to play KPD, KPF ruck etc. We have seen his raw talent. We just need to develop him properly. Early days he was rucking ahead of Soldo & Chol. Now those 2 have stepped up and played well. With JR back, Chol & Soldo being better ruck depth. Maybe KPD is a better option for Balta. Or as a tall winger? Its all about 2020 for Balta. No way he appears again in the senior team this year.
PS: Best wishes to all the old boys doing well. Lloyd, Miles, Conca, Stengle, Ellis. We miss none of them. I just hope it means we get good offers for Butler, Menadue, etc

 

[HTT]

I agree. It's an absolute con job.
PLAYERS ON INJURY/SUSPENSION LIST (19):

Taylor Adams (hamstring — TBC), James Aish (shoulder — TBC), Dayne Beams (hip — Indefinite), Jordan De Goey (hamstring — 2-3 weeks), Lynden Dunn (knee — Season), Levi Greenwood (hamstring — TBC), Will Kelly (hamstring — TBC), Tom Langdon (knee — season), Darcy Moore (hamstring — 2-3 weeks), Nathan Murphy (back — test), Sam Murray (provisional suspension — TBC), John Noble (calf — test), Tom Phillips (collarbone — test), Isaac Quaynor (foot stress — 3-4 weeks), Ben Reid (hamstring — TBC), Jordan Roughead (concussion — test), Jaidyn Stephenson (suspension — 5 weeks), Daniel Wells (knee — 5 weeks), Brayden Sier (calf — Test)

I think there’s 4 steps you could take to improve your situation
1) stop whinging
2) stop including dickheads that do drugs or bet on their own games
3) stop training on concrete
4) sack your entire medical team

6 years in a row isn’t ‘bad luck’ - it’s mismanagement.

 

[HeadandShin]

The bolded names are genuine losses, De Goey, Roughead and Phillips actually played on Friday night which was the context of Roos and Healy's comments.
Acts of stupidity don't belong on injury lists.
The other point that they made is that you are missing none of your best players.

And when your 5th (or perhaps 6th) player in line for captaincy gets the gig because those ahead of him are all out injured. Then you can complain....
And then we had lambert Nankervis Astbury Ross etc out as well. And we still gave Adelaide a scare at AO. There’s injuries and there’s injuries.

 

[tony__montana]

Toast to Gerard Healy and Paul Roos who just called out Collingwood's "injury crisis" as the furphy that it is!

Halleluja, finally someone called it out.

The bolded names are genuine losses, De Goey, Roughead and Phillips actually played on Friday night which was the context of Roos and Healy's comments.
Acts of stupidity don't belong on injury lists.
The other point that they made is that you are missing none of your best players.

Spot on - On another list in the media they had Roughead, DeGoey, Phillips and mayne listed even though all 4 played against us lol - not to mention the ones that will come off the list this week. Its clearly a bit of chest beating.

Most teams have 4-6 genuine A graders. Pies A graders are Grundy, pendles, Sidebottom, treloar, DeGoey and Id throw in Moore based on current form bc im generous. How many games have those players missed?

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

Halleluja, finally someone called it out.



Spot on - On another list in the media they had Roughead, DeGoey, Phillips and mayne listed even though all 4 played against us lol - not to mention the ones that will come off the list this week. Its clearly a bit of chest beating.

Most teams have 4-6 genuine A graders. Pies A graders are Grundy, pendles, Sidebottom, treloar, DeGoey and Id throw in Moore based on current form bc im generous. How many games have those players missed?

You tell us!

 

[tony__montana]

You tell us!

You can count em on one hand

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

You can count em on one hand

 

[TigerMoz1973]

SL has been taking a quit a few marks as well, it would be interesting to compare stats.
Agree about Balta and his tank and he is a little green still, but overall his game impact in my view would have been greater with less tank than Rioli. Rioli playing in form would be a different story.

Sydney Stack in his first game up forward showed them all how to play, how to run, when to run, where to position when the ball hits the pack and how to score at every opportunity.

If we are to improve and get ‘next level good’ our small forwards have to hit the score board more often.
Nothing hurts more than scoreboard pressure and when we play vs the eagles we are going to need more than RUN and CHASE.

Agree with all but I reckon you're under estimating Rioli's impact.

 

[TigerMoz1973]

Spot on mate. Those you listed all minnow spud role players. You had 15 play Friday that played in the PF. We also had 15 from that game so both were missing 7. We were missing two top 5 players tho in cotchin and rance.

Still thumped you in second gear lel

I would argue that we were missing 3 top 5 players with Nank not being out there.

 

[TigerMoz1973]

Caddy, Kmac, Nank, Ross, Marlion all out!

A little premature? He hasn't played a game for the club yet

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

Ok, ok...don't have Marlion up there then...

 

[Hoos]

Ok, ok...don't have Marlion up there then...

Not yet, anyway.

 

[telsor]

Yep definite quantity... not all that much quality though

I think part of the 'Collingwood injury crisis' comes down to them massively overrating their mid range players, then when they get injured they tell themselves it's yet another 'star' out, when really it's just a nuffy who would likely struggle to hold a spot in a full strength side.

 

[Bazzar]

I think part of the 'Collingwood injury crisis' comes down to them massively overrating their mid range players, then when they get injured they tell themselves it's yet another 'star' out, when really it's just a nuffy who would likely struggle to hold a spot in a full strength side.

Look at our second tier players who have come in to replace our injured players compared to the Pies.
Stack, Chol, Soldo, Bolton, Baker, Ross and to a lesser extent Naish, Balta, Garth and the Egg.

 

[RockJobster0312]

SL has been taking a quit a few marks as well, it would be interesting to compare stats.
Agree about Balta and his tank and he is a little green still, but overall his game impact in my view would have been greater with less tank than Rioli. Rioli playing in form would be a different story.

Sydney Stack in his first game up forward showed them all how to play, how to run, when to run, where to position when the ball hits the pack and how to score at every opportunity.

If we are to improve and get ‘next level good’ our small forwards have to hit the score board more often.
Nothing hurts more than scoreboard pressure and when we play vs the eagles we are going to need more than RUN and CHASE.

Rioli’s importance to the side is more than what you’ve highlighted here. And cannot agree in any shape or form that Balta would have a greater impact (despite my love of all things Noah).

Rioli’s role in the team is twofold; the first is as you say to run, chase and pressure (which he is elite at imo) opposition backman to not necessarily force mistakes, but enable our structures to be in best position to intercept the ball. It aims the ball carrier to make a decision slightly more rushed, and a kick to be slightly poorer placed and/ or force slightly more hang time.

The second is to run from the forward flanks up the wings to create space for our forwards to lead in behind. Castagna nor Stack play this role, Lambert and Rioli are very very good at it.

Without getting into an over analysis of the relationship between running patterns, structures and space to operate, the space that Riewoldt, Lynch, Stack, Castagna all have is in direct relation to Rioli’s ability to work up the field. It also has a direct impact with the quality of inside 50 entries (due to space and time Rioli creates by moving up field). I think FoxFooty highlighted Rioli in a passage against Port, this was despite Rioli not getting a possession in that particular passage of play.

Then you get into the wave of scoring patterns that opposition teams have outwardly said are the most difficult thing to play against. Rioli’s ability to push up and create space, then push back on oppo turnover enables that overlap run. It’s why he’s always in the top echolon of players in score involvements.

Long story short, no Rioli imo will impact our scoring negatively more than any one player not currently playing will add to it. His role is also different to Stack’s (who often starts as deepest forward) and thus the two shouldn’t be compared.

 

[JAKLAUGHING]

Rioli’s importance to the side is more than what you’ve highlighted here. And cannot agree in any shape or form that Balta would have a greater impact (despite my love of all things Noah).Rioli’s role in the team is twofold; the first is as you say to run, chase and pressure (which he is elite at imo) opposition backman to not necessarily force mistakes, but enable our structures to be in best position to intercept the ball. It aims the ball carrier to make a decision slightly more rushed, and a kick to be slightly poorer placed and/ or force slightly more hang time.The second is to run from the forward flanks up the wings to create space for our forwards to lead in behind. Castagna nor Stack play this role, Lambert and Rioli are very very good at it.Without getting into an over analysis of the relationship between running patterns, structures and space to operate, the space that Riewoldt, Lynch, Stack, Castagna all have is in direct relation to Rioli’s ability to work up the field. It also has a direct impact with the quality of inside 50 entries (due to space and time Rioli creates by moving up field). I think FoxFooty highlighted Rioli in a passage against Port, this was despite Rioli not getting a possession in that particular passage of play.Then you get into the wave of scoring patterns that opposition teams have outwardly said are the most difficult thing to play against. Rioli’s ability to push up and create space, then push back on oppo turnover enables that overlap run. It’s why he’s always in the top echolon of players in score involvements.

Long story short, no Rioli imo will impact our scoring negatively more than any one player not currently playing will add to it. His role is also different to Stack’s (who often starts as deepest forward) and thus the two shouldn’t be compared.

Rioli's speed/ability to create an extra over lapper in our defense cannot be under estimated or over looked!

 

[Vassp]

Rioli’s importance to the side is more than what you’ve highlighted here. And cannot agree in any shape or form that Balta would have a greater impact (despite my love of all things Noah).

Rioli’s role in the team is twofold; the first is as you say to run, chase and pressure (which he is elite at imo) opposition backman to not necessarily force mistakes, but enable our structures to be in best position to intercept the ball. It aims the ball carrier to make a decision slightly more rushed, and a kick to be slightly poorer placed and/ or force slightly more hang time.

The second is to run from the forward flanks up the wings to create space for our forwards to lead in behind. Castagna nor Stack play this role, Lambert and Rioli are very very good at it.

Without getting into an over analysis of the relationship between running patterns, structures and space to operate, the space that Riewoldt, Lynch, Stack, Castagna all have is in direct relation to Rioli’s ability to work up the field. It also has a direct impact with the quality of inside 50 entries (due to space and time Rioli creates by moving up field). I think FoxFooty highlighted Rioli in a passage against Port, this was despite Rioli not getting a possession in that particular passage of play.

Then you get into the wave of scoring patterns that opposition teams have outwardly said are the most difficult thing to play against. Rioli’s ability to push up and create space, then push back on oppo turnover enables that overlap run. It’s why he’s always in the top echolon of players in score involvements.

Long story short, no Rioli imo will impact our scoring negatively more than any one player not currently playing will add to it. His role is also different to Stack’s (who often starts as deepest forward) and thus the two shouldn’t be compared.

O
A well written reply, and l guess we are a little on opposite sides of a more accurate centre.

 

[Punt rd end]

Dusty to Benny

 

[HeadandShin]

A little premature? He hasn't played a game for the club yet

Grigg then

 

[peternorth]

Just watching this

 

[captain cotch 9]

Damien Hardwick said Jack Ross (syndesmosis) and Marlion Pickett(finger) may play VFL.

 

[kingy46]

You

insult much? Your points in regards to his work rate and pressure points are valid and l do appreciate what he does but there are two versions of playing up forwards, Sydney stacks version and Riolis, I’m saying I’d take Sydney stacks version. This is why stack is now playing up forwards, Rioli has to be effective when the ball doesn’t hit the ground and offer another dimension vs strong marking teams. Yes l am being a little harsh on Rioli. We all say things in here that goes off centre sometimes doesn’t mean we have no clue, just means we have different view points.

You said Rioli “has done nothing for the last 10 weeks”. I’m merely pointing out that if you attend games watch him closely and your view will differ.
A lot of people are very quick to jump off Rioli when he is super important to the way we play

 

[Bazzar]

You



You said Rioli “has done nothing for the last 10 weeks”. I’m merely pointing out that if you attend games watch him closely and your view will differ.
A lot of people are very quick to jump off Rioli when he is super important to the way we play

Talking footy highlighted his game last week, giving mention to his pressure and massive gut running and how he's gradually getting back to his premiership year.

 

[Billy Bob65]

Congratulations on the win.

Here are the midfield frequency stats from the match. If you haven't seen a previous post, this is an overall summary of how often your players were lining up as one of the 5 mids at bounces.

Overall Summary - 26 Bounces

Graham 22 (4w)
Edwards 21 (17w, 4i)
Ellis 21 wing
Prestia 20
Martin 18
Bolton 11 (2w)
Cotchin (inj) 4
Stack 4
Castagna 3 wing
Rioli 3 wing
Lambert 2 (1i, 1w)
Baker 1 wing

Rucks:
Soldo 19
Chol 7

Centre Clearances (as per Champion Data/AFL.com.au
Prestia 4
Martin 2
Cotchin 1
Chol 1
Baker 1
Soldo 1
Edwards 1
Bolton 1
Stack 1
Graham 1
Vlastuin 1

1st Half - 13

Edwards 11 (10w, 1i)
Prestia 11
Ellis 10 wing
Graham 9 (2w)
Martin 8
Cotchin 4
Bolton 4
Stack 3
Lambert 2 (1i, 1w)
Castagna 1 wing
Rioli 1 wing
Baker 1 wing

Soldo 10
Chol 3

2nd Half - 13

Graham 13 (2w)
Ellis 11 wing
Edwards 10 (7w, 3i)
Martin 10
Prestia 9
Bolton 7 (2w)
Castagna 2 wing
Rioli 2 wing
Stack 1

Soldo 9
Chol 4

Notes:
- Most ever starts for Bolton in an analysed game
- First time in analysed games that Graham has been the most used mid in a match
- Most ever ruck starts for Soldo in an analysed game
- Most starts for Castagna in analysed games since Rd 11, 2017