Autopsy AFL 2024 Round 13 - Bombers v Blues Sun June 9th 7:20pm AEST (MCG)

[OnceWeWereKings]

4 years aged 21 or 22 or something like that

though the better question is how many years until Essendon actually started playing him full time in the fwd line, because after we did that (finally), he kicked 51. previously he has played all over the ground and only rotated through the fwdline.

Are you sure it wasn’t until his 9th season as a 26 year old that he kicked more than 15 goals in a season?
Like last year?
So summarising your comment, he was a positional journeyman until as a 26 year old in 2023 he had a breakout year and kicked 51 goals.
Fairly accurate?

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Are you sure it wasn’t until his 9th season as a 26 year old that he kicked more than 15 goals in a season?
Like last year?
So summarising your comment, he was a positional journeyman until as a 26 year old in 2023 he had a breakout year and kicked 51 goals.
Fairly accurate?

no. he kicked 15 goals in 2019.

i fail to see what point you are making? or trying to make is a better statement.

 

[Ambrosia]

no. he kicked 15 goals in 2019.

i fail to see what point you are making? or trying to make is a better statement.

Think it’s going to be something stupid about Silvagni

 

[OnceWeWereKings]

no. he kicked 15 goals in 2019.

i fail to see what point you are making? or trying to make is a better statement.

You’ve also failed to see the “more than 15 goals” in any one season part as well.

The point being, your now first/ second picked forward was pretty much a journeyman / fringe player up until last year.

Very similar parallels to someone like say a Silvagni / Waterman

Yet you’ve scoffed at suggestions that better performed or similar performed players cannot be categorised as best 22 players for an opposition team.

When and if fit, IE; not currently injured, all of Cerra (Carroll) Docherty (Cowan) Cottrell (O Hollands) Martin (Fantasia) are best 22 and in for the players bracketed.
If playing one ruck, TDK, there’s a fair case that Silvagni comes in for one of Owies, Kennedy / Cincotta based on balance & Motlop in for one of Owies / Fogarty depending on form / development

 

[OnceWeWereKings]

Think it’s going to be something stupid about Silvagni

Be happy to discuss why you believe that would be stupid?

 

[HirdsTheWord]

You’ve also failed to see the “more than 15 goals” in any one season part as well.

The point being, your now first/ second picked forward was pretty much a journeyman / fringe player up until last year.

Very similar parallels to someone like say a Silvagni / Waterman

Yet you’ve scoffed at suggestions that better performed or similar performed players cannot be categorised as best 22 players for an opposition team.

When and if fit, IE; not currently injured, all of Cerra (Carroll) Docherty (Cowan) Cottrell (O Hollands) Martin (Fantasia) are best 22 and in for the players bracketed.
If playing one ruck, TDK, there’s a fair case that Silvagni comes in for one of Owies, Kennedy / Cincotta based on balance & Motlop in for one of Owies / Fogarty depending on form / development

something stupid about silvangi confirmed.



who gives a shit what players did 4 years ago?

Langford is top 5 (or thereabouts) in the coleman now, Silvagni is rubbish now.

If Carlton supporters genuinely think Silvagni is in their best 22 than Jesus, its more grim over there than we all thought.

 

[CCurnow3votes]

Cerra, Docherty and Maybe martin OK.... Cotterel......... and Silvagni? hahahah what?

surely you are taking the piss?

that injury list is like getting an assignment in high school and having to fluff the last 500 words to get the required word count.

Hoping your coach knows as little about our team as you seem to … it’ll be a romp!

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Hoping your coach knows as little about our team as you seem to … it’ll be a romp!

I'd suggest it's likely going to be a romp, regardless of what is discussed on big footy.

 

[CCurnow3votes]

I'd suggest it's likely going to be a romp, regardless of what is discussed on big footy.

Ayyyye, fingers crossed brother!

 

[HirdsTheWord]

Ayyyye, fingers crossed brother!

how the betting line is 11 points is pretty amazing.

value all day in this

 

[OnceWeWereKings]

something stupid about silvangi confirmed.

View attachment 2011054

who gives a shit what players did 4 years ago?

Langford is top 5 (or thereabouts) in the coleman now, Silvagni is rubbish now.

If Carlton supporters genuinely think Silvagni is in their best 22 than Jesus, its more grim over there than we all thought.

As I’d posted - Silvagni if fit is fringe best 22 depending of on team balance -
Nothing outlandish about that statement.
I appreciate the other points you’ve made of the other suggested best 22. Articulate

 

[Ambrosia]

Be happy to discuss why you believe that would be stupid?

Can you actually make the point first so I'm not guessing?

As I’d posted - Silvagni if fit is fringe best 22 depending of on team balance -
Nothing outlandish about that statement.

This now feels like you're backing away it.

 

[Sector 7G]

Have you not been anywhere near the main board for the first half of the season? Carlton fans been bemoaning injuries all season.

That being said complaining about fringe player injuries (Reid, Hobbs) does irk me.


Would say the future version of Doch is likely to be fringe. Is it 3 acls now?

When Carlton was complaining about injuries we were missing 4 from 2023 top 10 B&F plus 13-14 on the injury list. We are now missing 2 top 10 and 10 on the injury list so we are in much better shape as teams always have injuries.

EFC are missing 3 from the 2023 top 10 and 10 on the injury list. While EFC's injury list is worse than Carltons at the moment it is better than the worst Carlton suffered.

Injuries happen and Teams need to be able to cover players 11-23 being out of the side.

 

[Sector 7G]

something stupid about silvangi confirmed.

View attachment 2011054

who gives a shit what players did 4 years ago?

Langford is top 5 (or thereabouts) in the coleman now, Silvagni is rubbish now.

If Carlton supporters genuinely think Silvagni is in their best 22 than Jesus, its more grim over there than we all thought.

10 coaches votes against Port in the last game he played.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

When Carlton was complaining about injuries we were missing 4 from 2023 top 10 B&F plus 13-14 on the injury list. We are now missing 2 top 10 and 10 on the injury list so we are in much better shape as teams always have injuries.

EFC are missing 3 from the 2023 top 10 and 10 on the injury list. While EFC's injury list is worse than Carltons at the moment it is better than the worst Carlton suffered.

Injuries happen and Teams need to be able to cover players 11-23 being out of the side.

who cares

it's all just trying to create a safety blanket and give excuses if a team loses.

injuries happen, ppl need to deal with it.

even if both teams were full strength, Carlton would still likely be favourites. they are far stronger across the park and Right in the premiership window with their list profile. Carlton are probably 2-3 years ahead of where we want to be.

 

[Ambrosia]

When Carlton was complaining about injuries we were missing 4 from 2023 top 10 B&F plus 13-14 on the injury list. We are now missing 2 top 10 and 10 on the injury list so we are in much better shape as teams always have injuries.

EFC are missing 3 from the 2023 top 10 and 10 on the injury list. While EFC's injury list is worse than Carltons at the moment it is better than the worst Carlton suffered.

Injuries happen and Teams need to be able to cover players 11-23 being out of the side.

Not sure this is that relevant to my post? I'm not big on the injury excuse just pointing out its laughable to suggest Carlton fans haven't used it.

 

[HirdsTheWord]

10 coaches votes against Port in the last game he played.

yeah and those are few and far between.

 

[Cripps 'n' Blue Bloods]

Cerra, Docherty and Maybe martin OK.... Cotterel......... and Silvagni? hahahah what?

surely you are taking the piss?

that injury list is like getting an assignment in high school and having to fluff the last 500 words to get the required word count.

The fact that other supporters don't rate them means nothing.
Cottrell and Silvagni played 17 and 16 games respectively last year, in a team that finished 5th and made it to a prelim.
When both are/were healthy, they were pretty much in the side every week.
Neither are stars, but both know their roles and do them well. No team has 23 stars in the side and for most teams, the difference between being ok and being good, is those role players.

If you compare Silvagni's stats from last year to Langford's at the same age (2022), they're very similar, and that's with Jack having to spend a fair bit of time chopping out in the ruck.
Not saying that Jack would've had a breakout year this year, like Langford did last year, but that's simply not his role, as a 3rd tall, with McKay and Curnow in the side, but that doesn't mean he's NOT in the best side.

Cottrell I was ready to write off at the end of 2021. I didn't think he had what it took and didn't see a spot for him in the side. He was just a hard runner with poor disposal (59.97%).
To his credit, he stepped it up in 2022 and solidified his spot in the side as a defensive HF/wing. The next 2 seasons, his disposal efficiency shot up to 75.66% and 69.71% and is one of the better set shots in the team.

The idea from some people that if a player isn't a Cripps, Walsh or Curnow, that they can't be considered best 22, or important to the team, is just absurd.
It's possible that others have stepped up and stolen their spots while they are out (not necessarily a bad thing and, at the least, it creates competition for spots), but we won't know until they're back playing. All we DO know, is that, when they were playing, they were in the side more often than not.

I don't pretend to know who the good role players or fringe 22 players are at Essendon, so I wouldn't even attempt to tell Dons supporters who on their injury list is/isn't best 22.
/rant

 

[Malifice]

Only Cerra is best 22, rest are fringe, that's the difference. Reid and Hobbs our closest fringe but would replace current players easily.

If you think Docherty, Martin or Cotterill are fringe, you haven't watched much Carlton.

If fit, they're all best 22.

 

[HirdyLannister]

If you think Docherty, Martin or Cotterill are fringe, you haven't watched much Carlton.

If fit, they're all best 22.

So is Hunter and Baldwin

Martin hasn't played a full season since 2017 and barely averages a goal a game in a good year.

Quit clutching at straws, they're fighting for bottom 6 in the 22

 

[HirdsTheWord]

The fact that other supporters don't rate them means nothing.
Cottrell and Silvagni played 17 and 16 games respectively last year, in a team that finished 5th and made it to a prelim.
When both are/were healthy, they were pretty much in the side every week.
Neither are stars, but both know their roles and do them well. No team has 23 stars in the side and for most teams, the difference between being ok and being good, is those role players.

If you compare Silvagni's stats from last year to Langford's at the same age (2022), they're very similar, and that's with Jack having to spend a fair bit of time chopping out in the ruck.
Not saying that Jack would've had a breakout year this year, like Langford did last year, but that's simply not his role, as a 3rd tall, with McKay and Curnow in the side, but that doesn't mean he's NOT in the best side.

Cottrell I was ready to write off at the end of 2021. I didn't think he had what it took and didn't see a spot for him in the side. He was just a hard runner with poor disposal (59.97%).
To his credit, he stepped it up in 2022 and solidified his spot in the side as a defensive HF/wing. The next 2 seasons, his disposal efficiency shot up to 75.66% and 69.71% and is one of the better set shots in the team.

The idea from some people that if a player isn't a Cripps, Walsh or Curnow, that they can't be considered best 22, or important to the team, is just absurd.
It's possible that others have stepped up and stolen their spots while they are out (not necessarily a bad thing and, at the least, it creates competition for spots), but we won't know until they're back playing. All we DO know, is that, when they were playing, they were in the side more often than not.

I don't pretend to know who the good role players or fringe 22 players are at Essendon, so I wouldn't even attempt to tell Dons supporters who on their injury list is/isn't best 22.
/rant

I largely agree in that who cares who is injured. There is no glory to be had losing a game and then finding excuses or some kind of reason why.

Carlton supporters can rate Silvagni all you want, but I don't think he'd get a game at most clubs (in starting 22) and not long ago he barely got re-signed by Carlton in the first place.

 

[mike ross]

If you think Docherty, Martin or Cotterill are fringe, you haven't watched much Carlton.

If fit, they're all best 22.

As an Essendon supporter I agree. My Mrs is a blues girl and they are. Especially Cottrell, she loves him.

 

[hirdylloydy1]

I think unfortunately our injury list is made up of best 22 players save for hunter, couple with that a severe drop in form and defensive running over the last few weeks and it may not be pretty on sunday night, the bye cant come quick enough

 

[BOMBERS 4 LIFE!!!!]

I think unfortunately our injury list is made up of best 22 players save for hunter, couple with that a severe drop in form and defensive running over the last few weeks and it may not be pretty on sunday night, the bye cant come quick enough

Daper,Redman,Duursma after the bye hopefully

 

[terrybull]

Match of the round and preview of this years Grand Final. We are gonna see a club win their 17th flag this year.

Winner of this game will lose the Grand Final.

Remember you read it here first.